1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:21,670 [Music] 2 00:00:28,540 --> 00:00:24,920 you're in the para cast the gold 3 00:00:34,040 --> 00:00:28,550 standard of paranormal radio and now 4 00:00:35,990 --> 00:00:34,050 here's gene Steinberg with gene and 5 00:00:37,490 --> 00:00:36,000 Chris welcome back to the power cast in 6 00:00:39,889 --> 00:00:37,500 a couple of moments we'll be introducing 7 00:00:42,500 --> 00:00:39,899 rosemary ellen guiley who has written a 8 00:00:45,740 --> 00:00:42,510 new book with Rick Fisher called we Gaea 9 00:00:48,770 --> 00:00:45,750 gone wild but I'll tell you first before 10 00:00:49,850 --> 00:00:48,780 we hear about that my few experiences 11 00:00:51,709 --> 00:00:49,860 with the Ouija board when I was a 12 00:00:56,150 --> 00:00:51,719 teenager you really want to hear this 13 00:00:57,770 --> 00:00:56,160 Chris yeah sure it's a cool story but 14 00:01:00,349 --> 00:00:57,780 let's see had a close friend named 15 00:01:03,260 --> 00:01:00,359 Kenneth Halpert we grew up in Brooklyn 16 00:01:05,960 --> 00:01:03,270 New York and his mom got a Ouija board 17 00:01:08,690 --> 00:01:05,970 one day and started playing with it and 18 00:01:12,649 --> 00:01:08,700 getting all sorts of screwy crazy 19 00:01:15,320 --> 00:01:12,659 answers she always insisted that she 20 00:01:17,810 --> 00:01:15,330 didn't fake it that she wasn't moving 21 00:01:19,880 --> 00:01:17,820 the planchette subconsciously or 22 00:01:22,550 --> 00:01:19,890 manually or something but we were 23 00:01:24,170 --> 00:01:22,560 gaining all sorts of freaky answers now 24 00:01:26,300 --> 00:01:24,180 I've tried the Ouija board and it 25 00:01:28,609 --> 00:01:26,310 doesn't like me he didn't like my friend 26 00:01:30,020 --> 00:01:28,619 Kenny Albert who may be listening to the 27 00:01:33,410 --> 00:01:30,030 show and will contribute his wisdom 28 00:01:35,780 --> 00:01:33,420 maybe in our forums but his mother I 29 00:01:38,090 --> 00:01:35,790 don't know kind of strange 30 00:01:40,670 --> 00:01:38,100 maybe psychology we've been able to make 31 00:01:42,819 --> 00:01:40,680 one work myself it just sits there it 32 00:01:44,990 --> 00:01:42,829 doesn't like you 33 00:01:47,030 --> 00:01:45,000 well we're gonna have to ask rosemary 34 00:01:49,100 --> 00:01:47,040 when we get her on what's up with that I 35 00:01:50,899 --> 00:01:49,110 I haven't really tried that many times 36 00:01:54,139 --> 00:01:50,909 but the few times I did sides has 37 00:01:56,209 --> 00:01:54,149 appeared it it just kind of sat there I 38 00:01:58,459 --> 00:01:56,219 think maybe we got a yes or a No or 39 00:02:00,609 --> 00:01:58,469 something one time but well maybe your 40 00:02:03,050 --> 00:02:00,619 subconscious was asleep at the time 41 00:02:04,760 --> 00:02:03,060 possibly we'll have to see yeah you know 42 00:02:06,319 --> 00:02:04,770 there's definitely something to it I 43 00:02:08,690 --> 00:02:06,329 mean guys reading rows like this book 44 00:02:10,249 --> 00:02:08,700 it's like oh my god and that's probably 45 00:02:13,119 --> 00:02:10,259 just tip of the iceberg won't have to 46 00:02:15,849 --> 00:02:13,129 have to dive into some of these really 47 00:02:18,879 --> 00:02:15,859 amazing mind-bending accounts well I 48 00:02:19,929 --> 00:02:18,889 think if you think that a Ouija board is 49 00:02:22,569 --> 00:02:19,939 a parlor game 50 00:02:24,399 --> 00:02:22,579 it may not be before we bring on 51 00:02:27,190 --> 00:02:24,409 rosemary who's champing in the bit right 52 00:02:29,440 --> 00:02:27,200 now she's there she's available I want 53 00:02:31,929 --> 00:02:29,450 to tell you something I was reading this 54 00:02:33,640 --> 00:02:31,939 is a historical thing historical fact I 55 00:02:36,220 --> 00:02:33,650 was reading a publication called flying 56 00:02:38,349 --> 00:02:36,230 saucer Digest from a guy named Rick 57 00:02:40,500 --> 00:02:38,359 hilberg who was a longtime UFO 58 00:02:45,039 --> 00:02:40,510 researcher from the Cleveland area and 59 00:02:47,409 --> 00:02:45,049 he has been involved in this field for 60 00:02:49,270 --> 00:02:47,419 so many years he was a guest very 61 00:02:52,420 --> 00:02:49,280 recently when we had a special episode 62 00:02:57,360 --> 00:02:52,430 because of the passing of Lucius Farish 63 00:03:00,580 --> 00:02:57,370 weight reminded me that on September 12 64 00:03:04,479 --> 00:03:00,590 1952 I was born September 9th by the way 65 00:03:08,559 --> 00:03:04,489 but not that year September 12 1952 will 66 00:03:13,689 --> 00:03:08,569 be the 60th anniversary of the case of 67 00:03:16,240 --> 00:03:13,699 the flatwoods monster oh boy break out 68 00:03:20,259 --> 00:03:16,250 the fireworks and I kind of think here 69 00:03:22,839 --> 00:03:20,269 about all this that's kind of a singular 70 00:03:24,339 --> 00:03:22,849 kind of episode you know I would say 71 00:03:27,399 --> 00:03:24,349 that's about it standalone as they get 72 00:03:29,589 --> 00:03:27,409 yes you know most UFO cases we have some 73 00:03:32,649 --> 00:03:29,599 kind of repetition but in the case of 74 00:03:36,569 --> 00:03:32,659 the flatwoods monster it happened then 75 00:03:39,309 --> 00:03:36,579 in the evening and was never repeated 76 00:03:40,860 --> 00:03:39,319 yeah must have been just a quick like a 77 00:03:43,449 --> 00:03:40,870 rest stop or something on their way to 78 00:03:46,330 --> 00:03:43,459 stay to Reticuli actually they were 79 00:03:50,259 --> 00:03:46,340 going to the toy store to buy a Ouija 80 00:03:52,149 --> 00:03:50,269 board okay if you say so I'm not sure 81 00:03:54,490 --> 00:03:52,159 about that that monster guy I don't 82 00:03:56,259 --> 00:03:54,500 recall it having fingers but maybe well 83 00:03:58,330 --> 00:03:56,269 I just made that no fingers to operate 84 00:04:02,050 --> 00:03:58,340 the planchette which is the the device 85 00:04:03,610 --> 00:04:02,060 that spells out the words on the Ouija 86 00:04:05,800 --> 00:04:03,620 board and we'll get into the actual 87 00:04:07,539 --> 00:04:05,810 functionality of it obviously in the 88 00:04:09,189 --> 00:04:07,549 show how gross when I give us a 89 00:04:11,949 --> 00:04:09,199 background well we want we bring 90 00:04:13,659 --> 00:04:11,959 rosemary on and let her take it away you 91 00:04:15,429 --> 00:04:13,669 know what this is it because I don't 92 00:04:18,099 --> 00:04:15,439 claim to know a lot about Ouija boards I 93 00:04:19,810 --> 00:04:18,109 used to own one but I can't claim to 94 00:04:23,110 --> 00:04:19,820 know a lot about it actually I've owned 95 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:23,120 two in my life I found an old wood one 96 00:04:28,230 --> 00:04:26,410 okay you know in a garage sale and 97 00:04:30,990 --> 00:04:28,240 actually put it on my wall in college I 98 00:04:33,360 --> 00:04:31,000 got a Ouija board on my wall so that was 99 00:04:36,360 --> 00:04:33,370 what caused it well I just never could 100 00:04:38,280 --> 00:04:36,370 get it to work and and I don't know 101 00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:38,290 maybe it's just me maybe it's operator 102 00:04:44,310 --> 00:04:40,450 error or something I don't know people 103 00:04:46,020 --> 00:04:44,320 that that was just very in fact quite 104 00:04:47,610 --> 00:04:46,030 impressed with the kind of results that 105 00:04:50,490 --> 00:04:47,620 they got but you know I just was never 106 00:04:52,230 --> 00:04:50,500 able to do it for some reason well I'll 107 00:04:55,050 --> 00:04:52,240 tell you what let's bring on rosemary 108 00:04:59,190 --> 00:04:55,060 ellen guiley rosemary hi there James 109 00:05:00,180 --> 00:04:59,200 Chris hey how are you doing I'm doing 110 00:05:03,570 --> 00:05:00,190 quite well thank you 111 00:05:05,010 --> 00:05:03,580 yeah just cranking these books out I 112 00:05:08,160 --> 00:05:05,020 love this one 113 00:05:11,340 --> 00:05:08,170 the Ouija gone wild this is a amazing 114 00:05:14,220 --> 00:05:11,350 story just jam-packed with all kinds of 115 00:05:15,930 --> 00:05:14,230 really cool stuff welcome to the show 116 00:05:18,030 --> 00:05:15,940 welcome back thank you it's just great 117 00:05:20,190 --> 00:05:18,040 to be back you know this project was in 118 00:05:23,460 --> 00:05:20,200 in the works for several years Rick and 119 00:05:25,080 --> 00:05:23,470 I conceived the idea for it several 120 00:05:27,900 --> 00:05:25,090 years ago while we were sitting around a 121 00:05:30,630 --> 00:05:27,910 weekend a holiday weekend with a group 122 00:05:33,780 --> 00:05:30,640 of paranormal friends in Gettysburg 123 00:05:36,960 --> 00:05:33,790 doing ghost research and that's where 124 00:05:39,480 --> 00:05:36,970 this idea was born both of us have felt 125 00:05:41,490 --> 00:05:39,490 that the Ouija board is one of the most 126 00:05:44,090 --> 00:05:41,500 fascinating spirit communications 127 00:05:49,110 --> 00:05:44,100 devices and probably the most 128 00:05:51,240 --> 00:05:49,120 misunderstood and the most maligned you 129 00:05:52,950 --> 00:05:51,250 care to elaborate on that a little bit 130 00:05:54,300 --> 00:05:52,960 while we still actually let's start with 131 00:05:58,380 --> 00:05:54,310 some background most people I think 132 00:06:00,690 --> 00:05:58,390 don't realize how old the actual idea of 133 00:06:03,330 --> 00:06:00,700 a talking board is and once you give us 134 00:06:06,270 --> 00:06:03,340 a little background on this particular 135 00:06:09,000 --> 00:06:06,280 system or style of divination and how 136 00:06:10,770 --> 00:06:09,010 that evolved into the Ouija board which 137 00:06:13,440 --> 00:06:10,780 is the most popular obviously of a 138 00:06:15,900 --> 00:06:13,450 number of them the device that we call 139 00:06:18,930 --> 00:06:15,910 the Ouija board officially goes back to 140 00:06:23,190 --> 00:06:18,940 1891 when the patent was issued for it 141 00:06:25,980 --> 00:06:23,200 but similar devices have been in use in 142 00:06:28,980 --> 00:06:25,990 different divination methods around the 143 00:06:31,920 --> 00:06:28,990 globe really since ancient times using 144 00:06:35,100 --> 00:06:31,930 some sort of counting or number or 145 00:06:39,060 --> 00:06:35,110 letter pointer or device to get spirits 146 00:06:40,179 --> 00:06:39,070 to spell out messages and people have 147 00:06:43,209 --> 00:06:40,189 used 148 00:06:44,949 --> 00:06:43,219 various writing instruments automatic 149 00:06:46,479 --> 00:06:44,959 writing is a form of spirit 150 00:06:51,509 --> 00:06:46,489 communication that people have also 151 00:06:54,639 --> 00:06:51,519 attached pencils to platforms and 152 00:06:57,429 --> 00:06:54,649 similar to the the pointer that the 153 00:06:59,229 --> 00:06:57,439 Ouija board uses to spell out messages 154 00:07:01,540 --> 00:06:59,239 those who are quite popular during the 155 00:07:02,169 --> 00:07:01,550 19th century when spiritualism got its 156 00:07:04,299 --> 00:07:02,179 start 157 00:07:06,100 --> 00:07:04,309 I want to ask kind of a simple stupid 158 00:07:06,459 --> 00:07:06,110 question here because I'm very good at 159 00:07:12,480 --> 00:07:06,469 that 160 00:07:15,459 --> 00:07:12,490 communicate in this particular fashion 161 00:07:18,009 --> 00:07:15,469 why something that would be a pointing 162 00:07:20,589 --> 00:07:18,019 device to point to letters or numbers I 163 00:07:22,239 --> 00:07:20,599 think because human beings have had a 164 00:07:24,699 --> 00:07:22,249 great deal of difficulty communicating 165 00:07:27,489 --> 00:07:24,709 with the spirit world so it well it were 166 00:07:30,009 --> 00:07:27,499 that easy all of us would you know do it 167 00:07:32,079 --> 00:07:30,019 all the time we would have some sort of 168 00:07:33,489 --> 00:07:32,089 direct communication the spirit 169 00:07:36,040 --> 00:07:33,499 communication has always been rather 170 00:07:39,249 --> 00:07:36,050 indirect we've had to have mediums 171 00:07:41,859 --> 00:07:39,259 either a device or a person who seems to 172 00:07:44,469 --> 00:07:41,869 have the right antenna so to speak to to 173 00:07:46,719 --> 00:07:44,479 get a signal from the beyond a message 174 00:07:51,309 --> 00:07:46,729 from the beyond and be able to put it 175 00:07:54,609 --> 00:07:51,319 into a material form either through 176 00:07:57,369 --> 00:07:54,619 direct voice or through writing in order 177 00:08:00,040 --> 00:07:57,379 to deliver the message to to the living 178 00:08:02,829 --> 00:08:00,050 and so human beings have come up with 179 00:08:06,279 --> 00:08:02,839 all sorts of divination methods and 180 00:08:09,429 --> 00:08:06,289 mediumistic methods to try to reach the 181 00:08:16,959 --> 00:08:09,439 dead and spirits this is an urgent 182 00:08:20,259 --> 00:08:16,969 humanitarian essentially a toy that you 183 00:08:21,699 --> 00:08:20,269 buy in a toy store Toys R Us or your 184 00:08:23,739 --> 00:08:21,709 water at Amazon or something 185 00:08:27,459 --> 00:08:23,749 well the Ouija board originally wasn't 186 00:08:31,629 --> 00:08:27,469 so much a toy it was marketed as a 187 00:08:35,290 --> 00:08:31,639 spirit communication device and it came 188 00:08:38,259 --> 00:08:35,300 on at a time when mediumship was still 189 00:08:40,329 --> 00:08:38,269 very popular the spiritualism movement 190 00:08:42,850 --> 00:08:40,339 really got off the ground in the early 191 00:08:44,889 --> 00:08:42,860 to mid 19th century the Ouija board came 192 00:08:47,230 --> 00:08:44,899 along right at the tail end of the 19th 193 00:08:49,299 --> 00:08:47,240 century and what it did was it put 194 00:08:50,829 --> 00:08:49,309 mediumship in the hands of the average 195 00:08:52,809 --> 00:08:50,839 person you didn't have to go to a 196 00:08:53,480 --> 00:08:52,819 somebody else's seance you could do your 197 00:08:55,519 --> 00:08:53,490 own sail 198 00:08:57,740 --> 00:08:55,529 you could talk to the spirits right in 199 00:09:00,019 --> 00:08:57,750 your own living room so it was both a 200 00:09:03,740 --> 00:09:00,029 spirit communication device and an 201 00:09:07,519 --> 00:09:03,750 entertainment device but it was largely 202 00:09:10,639 --> 00:09:07,529 a tax court ruling that got the Ouija 203 00:09:14,480 --> 00:09:10,649 board classified as a game or a toy and 204 00:09:18,380 --> 00:09:14,490 that was because a competitor the Ouija 205 00:09:22,460 --> 00:09:18,390 board went to court with the IRS against 206 00:09:25,340 --> 00:09:22,470 the IRS so basically here the IRS is 207 00:09:28,250 --> 00:09:25,350 getting involved in a dispute over 208 00:09:29,990 --> 00:09:28,260 something that is supposed to channel 209 00:09:32,630 --> 00:09:30,000 psychic powers and this is very unusual 210 00:09:36,440 --> 00:09:32,640 I mean nowadays of course it's whether 211 00:09:38,810 --> 00:09:36,450 you imitated the iPhone or the iPad but 212 00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:38,820 we're talking about a time when this 213 00:09:44,180 --> 00:09:41,970 kind of device boy strange I want to ask 214 00:09:46,790 --> 00:09:44,190 you more about that Kris and I the book 215 00:09:48,380 --> 00:09:46,800 is called we joke gone wild and sounds 216 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:48,390 like the lawsuit went wild with rosemary 217 00:09:52,430 --> 00:09:50,490 ellen guiley and rick fisher writing the 218 00:10:00,199 --> 00:09:52,440 book you're on with gene and Kris you're 219 00:10:02,090 --> 00:10:00,209 in America you know during the summer it 220 00:10:03,260 --> 00:10:02,100 seems like just about everyone is on a 221 00:10:06,019 --> 00:10:03,270 different schedule 222 00:10:08,120 --> 00:10:06,029 yeah vacations shorter days people are 223 00:10:10,400 --> 00:10:08,130 working remotely so meeting all your 224 00:10:12,440 --> 00:10:10,410 clients and colleagues in person can be 225 00:10:16,040 --> 00:10:12,450 well impossible that's why I recommend 226 00:10:17,810 --> 00:10:16,050 goto meeting with HD faces it 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00:13:51,220 foods direct comm four slash Alex eat 326 00:13:54,030 --> 00:13:52,450 foods is so affordable 327 00:13:56,010 --> 00:13:54,040 the more you store and eat the more you 328 00:13:57,630 --> 00:13:56,020 save well the e foods direct comm four 329 00:14:01,410 --> 00:13:57,640 slash Alex or call eight hundred four oh 330 00:14:03,390 --> 00:14:01,420 nine five six three three right now we'd 331 00:14:05,400 --> 00:14:03,400 like to hear from you if you have a 332 00:14:09,329 --> 00:14:05,410 comment a question about the para cast 333 00:14:12,630 --> 00:14:09,339 sent to 2 News at the para cast com 334 00:14:14,790 --> 00:14:12,640 that's news at the para cast dot-com and 335 00:14:17,970 --> 00:14:14,800 don't forget to visit our famous para 336 00:14:21,960 --> 00:14:17,980 cast community forums at forum dot the 337 00:14:22,470 --> 00:14:21,970 para cast com we have rosemary ellen 338 00:14:24,690 --> 00:14:22,480 guiley 339 00:14:26,730 --> 00:14:24,700 returning to the para cast to talk about 340 00:14:28,970 --> 00:14:26,740 the new book she wrote with rick Fisher 341 00:14:32,340 --> 00:14:28,980 called Ouija gone wild subtitled 342 00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:32,350 shocking true stories shocking true 343 00:14:34,620 --> 00:14:32,890 stories 344 00:14:36,390 --> 00:14:34,630 now I'm shocked and I guess we want more 345 00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:36,400 information about this I'm shocked 346 00:14:40,620 --> 00:14:39,970 rosemary about the lawsuit let's go into 347 00:14:42,960 --> 00:14:40,630 more details 348 00:14:45,390 --> 00:14:42,970 well the Ouija board was gaining more 349 00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:45,400 popularity the first board came out in 350 00:14:52,769 --> 00:14:48,930 1892 the patent was issued in 1891 and 351 00:14:55,610 --> 00:14:52,779 the toy company and it was a novelty 352 00:14:58,949 --> 00:14:55,620 company that actually started with this 353 00:15:01,790 --> 00:14:58,959 was you know trying to get it into the 354 00:15:04,230 --> 00:15:01,800 the mass market and there were imitators 355 00:15:07,590 --> 00:15:04,240 competitors who saw that it was a good 356 00:15:10,170 --> 00:15:07,600 thing a lot of competition and sound 357 00:15:13,290 --> 00:15:10,180 like the current tech patent disputes 358 00:15:15,410 --> 00:15:13,300 doesn't mean it's absolutely we've we've 359 00:15:18,360 --> 00:15:15,420 had legal disputes over technology 360 00:15:20,640 --> 00:15:18,370 throughout history the technology keeps 361 00:15:23,579 --> 00:15:20,650 changing so this was technology back in 362 00:15:25,110 --> 00:15:23,589 the early 20th century and in 1920 there 363 00:15:27,269 --> 00:15:25,120 was a company called the Baltimore 364 00:15:30,179 --> 00:15:27,279 talking board which was a competitor 365 00:15:33,059 --> 00:15:30,189 to the Ouija board and they actually 366 00:15:35,850 --> 00:15:33,069 sold Ouija boards it's not clear whether 367 00:15:38,160 --> 00:15:35,860 or not they licensed the name they 368 00:15:39,900 --> 00:15:38,170 probably did but at any rate the IRS 369 00:15:43,679 --> 00:15:39,910 came along and said this is really a 370 00:15:46,259 --> 00:15:43,689 game and you have to pay taxes on it and 371 00:15:48,540 --> 00:15:46,269 they said no we don't consider it a game 372 00:15:51,660 --> 00:15:48,550 it's a spirit communication device so 373 00:15:53,730 --> 00:15:51,670 they went to court and they went clear 374 00:15:55,850 --> 00:15:53,740 up a line until they appealed their case 375 00:15:58,619 --> 00:15:55,860 to the United States Supreme Court and 376 00:16:01,139 --> 00:15:58,629 the media was really expecting quite a 377 00:16:04,679 --> 00:16:01,149 field day over this but the supreme 378 00:16:06,980 --> 00:16:04,689 court perhaps wisely decided to reject 379 00:16:10,679 --> 00:16:06,990 the case and not take it on which 380 00:16:12,689 --> 00:16:10,689 validated the lower court ruling and so 381 00:16:15,660 --> 00:16:12,699 the boards have been considered games 382 00:16:18,569 --> 00:16:15,670 and toys ever since so because of that 383 00:16:20,970 --> 00:16:18,579 now went through places like what Parker 384 00:16:23,309 --> 00:16:20,980 Brothers Parker Brothers made the Ouija 385 00:16:26,910 --> 00:16:23,319 board win and I bought mine and now it's 386 00:16:29,910 --> 00:16:26,920 Hasbro yes the patent for the board 387 00:16:31,559 --> 00:16:29,920 changed hands a number of times in the 388 00:16:34,309 --> 00:16:31,569 early days and it wound up under the 389 00:16:37,650 --> 00:16:34,319 control of a man named William Fuld and 390 00:16:40,439 --> 00:16:37,660 he managed to consolidate all of the 391 00:16:42,449 --> 00:16:40,449 rights under his own name even kind of 392 00:16:45,059 --> 00:16:42,459 cut his brother Isaac out of the action 393 00:16:47,910 --> 00:16:45,069 and started a big family feud but the 394 00:16:51,179 --> 00:16:47,920 board went up and down in its in its own 395 00:16:54,329 --> 00:16:51,189 fortunes up through the 50s and 60s and 396 00:16:58,619 --> 00:16:54,339 in the 1960s had a resurgence in 397 00:17:01,850 --> 00:16:58,629 popularity and at that point the board 398 00:17:05,610 --> 00:17:01,860 was sold to Parker Brothers and then 399 00:17:07,620 --> 00:17:05,620 Parker Brothers was a I think they were 400 00:17:09,659 --> 00:17:07,630 acquired by you know they weren't 401 00:17:13,230 --> 00:17:09,669 several changes of hands before Hasbro 402 00:17:17,960 --> 00:17:13,240 got them in the early 1990s so now it's 403 00:17:21,809 --> 00:17:17,970 part of the oat anka Parker Brothers got 404 00:17:24,569 --> 00:17:21,819 acquired by Parker Brothers got acquired 405 00:17:26,579 --> 00:17:24,579 by General Mills and then General Mills 406 00:17:29,549 --> 00:17:26,589 operation let me go understand this now 407 00:17:32,580 --> 00:17:29,559 so you could buy a Ouija board and buy 408 00:17:34,110 --> 00:17:32,590 some cereal they should have put they 409 00:17:36,660 --> 00:17:34,120 should have made big boxes and put the 410 00:17:39,630 --> 00:17:36,670 board in the cereal okay 411 00:17:41,280 --> 00:17:39,640 it winds up with punk and then that goes 412 00:17:45,030 --> 00:17:41,290 on to Hasbro so they've had it since 413 00:17:48,660 --> 00:17:45,040 1991 okay but basically it is considered 414 00:17:50,700 --> 00:17:48,670 a toy it is yeah so it's it's an 415 00:17:52,230 --> 00:17:50,710 entertainment device although some 416 00:17:53,850 --> 00:17:52,240 people who get very serious about the 417 00:17:56,750 --> 00:17:53,860 Ouija board would never call it a toy 418 00:17:59,640 --> 00:17:56,760 they consider it to be a very serious 419 00:18:01,560 --> 00:17:59,650 device to open up a doorway to the 420 00:18:03,630 --> 00:18:01,570 spirit world how many of these things 421 00:18:05,370 --> 00:18:03,640 are being sold and you know in the 422 00:18:08,760 --> 00:18:05,380 modern day now I mean is it still a 423 00:18:11,820 --> 00:18:08,770 viable popular product for the company 424 00:18:13,950 --> 00:18:11,830 it must be at its peak it was out 425 00:18:16,860 --> 00:18:13,960 selling monopoly and I don't have exact 426 00:18:18,510 --> 00:18:16,870 figures but monopoly has reigned as the 427 00:18:20,130 --> 00:18:18,520 biggest selling board game for quite 428 00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:20,140 some time and now it's slipped below 429 00:18:25,530 --> 00:18:23,170 monopoly but whenever we have a horror 430 00:18:28,290 --> 00:18:25,540 film that comes out where the Ouija 431 00:18:31,530 --> 00:18:28,300 board has a presence unfortunately as a 432 00:18:33,570 --> 00:18:31,540 demonic device usually that does send 433 00:18:35,910 --> 00:18:33,580 the board back into popularity it's a 434 00:18:38,790 --> 00:18:35,920 lot of people like the idea of playing 435 00:18:40,590 --> 00:18:38,800 with something dangerous yeah we'll get 436 00:18:43,980 --> 00:18:40,600 into that later the misperception 437 00:18:46,350 --> 00:18:43,990 surrounding it but I'm just intrigued 438 00:18:48,210 --> 00:18:46,360 and it had so much staying power and 439 00:18:50,160 --> 00:18:48,220 that it's still something that you can 440 00:18:51,870 --> 00:18:50,170 go out and buy today and it's you know 441 00:18:53,490 --> 00:18:51,880 it's a hundred and thirty almost on in 442 00:18:56,610 --> 00:18:53,500 twenty something years old it's amazing 443 00:18:59,340 --> 00:18:56,620 most of the people who start with this 444 00:19:01,140 --> 00:18:59,350 device do so for entertainment and in 445 00:19:02,820 --> 00:19:01,150 fact when Rick and I were collecting 446 00:19:06,330 --> 00:19:02,830 stories for the book and I still get 447 00:19:09,320 --> 00:19:06,340 them usually by email many of the 448 00:19:11,370 --> 00:19:09,330 stories are told about people who had 449 00:19:14,790 --> 00:19:11,380 experiences when they were a teenager 450 00:19:17,550 --> 00:19:14,800 and many adults have weird experiences 451 00:19:20,610 --> 00:19:17,560 too but it's been a favorite device of 452 00:19:22,170 --> 00:19:20,620 kids to say hey let's see what happens 453 00:19:25,290 --> 00:19:22,180 let's get a Ouija board out maybe we'll 454 00:19:28,170 --> 00:19:25,300 get a thrill it's a party device and a 455 00:19:30,630 --> 00:19:28,180 lot of times nothing happens many times 456 00:19:33,300 --> 00:19:30,640 accurate information comes across the 457 00:19:36,840 --> 00:19:33,310 board but a lot of times people have 458 00:19:38,400 --> 00:19:36,850 really frightening experiences do and 459 00:19:41,430 --> 00:19:38,410 get frightening messages that they act 460 00:19:43,590 --> 00:19:41,440 that act upon which I'm sure you can 461 00:19:44,880 --> 00:19:43,600 come up our that apples of that even 462 00:19:47,250 --> 00:19:44,890 though they are weird and ones in their 463 00:19:49,310 --> 00:19:47,260 stuff that goes to court that becomes a 464 00:19:51,830 --> 00:19:49,320 major part of you know 465 00:19:53,900 --> 00:19:51,840 we'll high-profile trials even murder 466 00:19:56,660 --> 00:19:53,910 trials that sort of thing well what do 467 00:19:59,900 --> 00:19:56,670 you think was my duties let's look at 468 00:20:01,460 --> 00:19:59,910 the actual functionality of it and you 469 00:20:03,260 --> 00:20:01,470 know with all this research that the two 470 00:20:05,750 --> 00:20:03,270 of you have done and you've actually 471 00:20:07,340 --> 00:20:05,760 used the board and talked to numerous 472 00:20:09,260 --> 00:20:07,350 people that have used it what do you 473 00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:09,270 think is actually going on with it is it 474 00:20:13,580 --> 00:20:11,250 is it something that's being led by the 475 00:20:15,350 --> 00:20:13,590 subconscious of the actual participants 476 00:20:17,780 --> 00:20:15,360 or do you actually feel that there is 477 00:20:21,260 --> 00:20:17,790 some sort of connection to some other 478 00:20:23,150 --> 00:20:21,270 other realm I do believe that in many 479 00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:23,160 cases people make a genuine connection 480 00:20:28,450 --> 00:20:26,250 to the spirit realm we can't rule out 481 00:20:31,700 --> 00:20:28,460 that there are cases involving 482 00:20:35,300 --> 00:20:31,710 subconscious movement you place your 483 00:20:37,610 --> 00:20:35,310 hands on a pointer on this board and ask 484 00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:37,620 the spirits to through your hands move 485 00:20:42,470 --> 00:20:38,970 the pointer around to spell out 486 00:20:46,340 --> 00:20:42,480 letter-by-letter messages you can point 487 00:20:50,290 --> 00:20:46,350 to goodbye yes/no and numbers as well 488 00:20:53,270 --> 00:20:50,300 and in many cases there may be 489 00:20:57,170 --> 00:20:53,280 subconscious you know subconscious and 490 00:20:58,580 --> 00:20:57,180 Kant on a certain answer that impulses 491 00:21:01,100 --> 00:20:58,590 take over it's called the ideomotor 492 00:21:03,260 --> 00:21:01,110 effect that you might not even be aware 493 00:21:06,350 --> 00:21:03,270 of the fact that you're influencing the 494 00:21:09,080 --> 00:21:06,360 movement of this device yourself what on 495 00:21:11,420 --> 00:21:09,090 the other hand it's very easy to move - 496 00:21:12,650 --> 00:21:11,430 we must stress that when the lightest 497 00:21:15,800 --> 00:21:12,660 bit of pressure will make that 498 00:21:19,010 --> 00:21:15,810 planchette move it can but I have had 499 00:21:20,780 --> 00:21:19,020 many Ouija board sessions where I've had 500 00:21:22,640 --> 00:21:20,790 my hands on the pointer and so has 501 00:21:24,770 --> 00:21:22,650 another person and it's hardly moved at 502 00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:24,780 all no matter how much you want it to 503 00:21:31,910 --> 00:21:28,170 start spelling something out but I do 504 00:21:35,630 --> 00:21:31,920 think that in other cases something else 505 00:21:38,270 --> 00:21:35,640 takes over and this seems to be for the 506 00:21:40,400 --> 00:21:38,280 for the problematic cases this seems to 507 00:21:42,770 --> 00:21:40,410 tap into what I would call low-level 508 00:21:45,680 --> 00:21:42,780 astral realm where you're more likely to 509 00:21:49,130 --> 00:21:45,690 get trickster spirits masquerading as 510 00:21:52,610 --> 00:21:49,140 whatever you want rather than you know 511 00:21:55,820 --> 00:21:52,620 dead Aunt Sarah or some high-level 512 00:21:58,280 --> 00:21:55,830 spirit in many cases the messages start 513 00:22:00,380 --> 00:21:58,290 out friendly there may even be accurate 514 00:22:03,169 --> 00:22:00,390 information that somebody can validate 515 00:22:07,009 --> 00:22:03,179 and then just when you've sort of 516 00:22:09,259 --> 00:22:07,019 your trust over to this process usually 517 00:22:12,950 --> 00:22:09,269 through repeated use the messages 518 00:22:15,219 --> 00:22:12,960 suddenly take a nasty turn and people 519 00:22:18,049 --> 00:22:15,229 can have quite a lot of psychological 520 00:22:20,299 --> 00:22:18,059 destabilization at that point oh boy 521 00:22:21,950 --> 00:22:20,309 psychological destabilization I'm going 522 00:22:24,259 --> 00:22:21,960 to ask you about that when we come back 523 00:22:27,229 --> 00:22:24,269 from our break the book by rosemary 524 00:22:29,869 --> 00:22:27,239 ellen guiley with rick fisher is called 525 00:22:33,680 --> 00:22:29,879 weed gone wild and it's subtitled 526 00:22:35,269 --> 00:22:33,690 shocking true stories and I guess we 527 00:22:37,820 --> 00:22:35,279 should look at the shocking stories 528 00:22:40,910 --> 00:22:37,830 coming up in our next segment with gene 529 00:22:48,930 --> 00:22:40,920 and Chris you're in the para cast 530 00:22:54,580 --> 00:22:51,149 America's number one source for 531 00:22:59,680 --> 00:22:54,590 independent talk radio for over a decade 532 00:23:02,109 --> 00:22:59,690 we are the gcn radio network if you want 533 00:23:05,049 --> 00:23:02,119 to get your website online and you need 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team comm or call eight 577 00:24:55,820 --> 00:24:54,320 seven seven eight seven eight four two 578 00:24:58,490 --> 00:24:55,830 zero three news 579 00:25:01,789 --> 00:24:58,500 wait and look great with ASAP as slim as 580 00:25:03,830 --> 00:25:01,799 possible the man who predicted the fall 581 00:25:04,700 --> 00:25:03,840 of communism is now predicting the fall 582 00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:04,710 of capitalism 583 00:25:07,850 --> 00:25:06,330 he's dying with the Rockefellers hung 584 00:25:09,590 --> 00:25:07,860 out with the Clintons banged heads with 585 00:25:11,210 --> 00:25:09,600 the Beltway and inspired company's 586 00:25:12,950 --> 00:25:11,220 movements and empires that have brought 587 00:25:14,750 --> 00:25:12,960 forth revolutionary change 588 00:25:16,850 --> 00:25:14,760 he sat shoulder to shoulder with figures 589 00:25:18,769 --> 00:25:16,860 like George Bush Senior Steve Forbes 590 00:25:19,399 --> 00:25:18,779 Margaret Thatcher and Boris Yeltsin to 591 00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:19,409 name but a few 592 00:25:22,639 --> 00:25:21,090 and his volume of work set out his 593 00:25:24,980 --> 00:25:22,649 groundbreaking financial newsletter 594 00:25:25,370 --> 00:25:24,990 strategic investment was so far ahead of 595 00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:25,380 its time 596 00:25:29,060 --> 00:25:27,450 it helped transform not just the fates 597 00:25:31,009 --> 00:25:29,070 and fortunes of thousands of investors 598 00:25:33,620 --> 00:25:31,019 but also the fates and fortunes of 599 00:25:35,389 --> 00:25:33,630 entire nations for the first time in 17 600 00:25:37,490 --> 00:25:35,399 years he's back once again with his 601 00:25:40,159 --> 00:25:37,500 first controversial video presentation 602 00:25:42,049 --> 00:25:40,169 go to fall of capitalism calm to watch 603 00:25:43,519 --> 00:25:42,059 him reveal a landmark development which 604 00:25:45,740 --> 00:25:43,529 he believes will set off the most 605 00:25:47,269 --> 00:25:45,750 violent economic reversal in history one 606 00:25:49,460 --> 00:25:47,279 that carries the power to bring down the 607 00:25:51,139 --> 00:25:49,470 entire capitalist system go to fall of 608 00:25:53,060 --> 00:25:51,149 capitalism calm to watch his 609 00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:53,070 controversial video before the powers 610 00:25:58,659 --> 00:25:54,450 that be wipe it from the internet 611 00:26:01,850 --> 00:25:58,669 again it's WWF all of capitalism calm 612 00:26:04,220 --> 00:26:01,860 let's keep preparedness simple do you 613 00:26:07,639 --> 00:26:04,230 need stuff for disasters of course you 614 00:26:11,149 --> 00:26:07,649 do for over 15 years disaster stuff calm 615 00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:11,159 has well stuff for disasters see easy to 616 00:26:14,659 --> 00:26:11,610 remember 617 00:26:16,940 --> 00:26:14,669 disaster stuff calm want free shipping 618 00:26:19,519 --> 00:26:16,950 on an uber key water filter disaster 619 00:26:21,500 --> 00:26:19,529 stuff calm is the official Berkey in 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00:26:53,639 be simple and it is just remember 635 00:26:57,889 --> 00:26:56,309 disaster stuff calm freedom through 636 00:27:01,979 --> 00:26:57,899 self-reliance and personal 637 00:27:06,669 --> 00:27:04,269 this is Leslie Kane and I'm with the 638 00:27:10,509 --> 00:27:06,679 Coalition for freedom of information and 639 00:27:12,220 --> 00:27:10,519 you are listening to the podcast with 640 00:27:15,190 --> 00:27:12,230 Jeanne and Chris you're in the power 641 00:27:16,590 --> 00:27:15,200 cast and Chris is speaking to us from a 642 00:27:20,919 --> 00:27:16,600 location where they're having a rather 643 00:27:24,220 --> 00:27:20,929 intense lightning storm so if he starts 644 00:27:31,029 --> 00:27:24,230 glowing or sparkling or disappears 645 00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:31,039 that's the reason right Chris I love 646 00:27:35,619 --> 00:27:32,690 this time of year got the bond thing 647 00:27:37,869 --> 00:27:35,629 back in Arizona we have rosemary ellen 648 00:27:40,690 --> 00:27:37,879 guiley the book is we G gone wild 649 00:27:42,879 --> 00:27:40,700 shocking true stories and we hinted at 650 00:27:45,399 --> 00:27:42,889 this rosemary that some of the stories 651 00:27:49,029 --> 00:27:45,409 involving a Ouija board aren't just 652 00:27:51,489 --> 00:27:49,039 seeing silly displays with the 653 00:27:54,279 --> 00:27:51,499 planchette silly messages yes no 654 00:27:57,430 --> 00:27:54,289 whatever something more sinister explain 655 00:27:59,379 --> 00:27:57,440 we have cases in a number of different 656 00:28:01,590 --> 00:27:59,389 categories where people have made very 657 00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:01,600 irrational even criminal decisions 658 00:28:07,919 --> 00:28:04,690 murders people have committed suicide 659 00:28:11,950 --> 00:28:07,929 invested lost fortunes married divorced 660 00:28:15,369 --> 00:28:11,960 abused other people gone AWOL from the 661 00:28:19,119 --> 00:28:15,379 Army I mean you name it people have 662 00:28:21,099 --> 00:28:19,129 pinned irrational decisions on messages 663 00:28:24,279 --> 00:28:21,109 through the Ouija board now in many of 664 00:28:27,849 --> 00:28:24,289 these cases I strongly suspect that 665 00:28:30,279 --> 00:28:27,859 people are inclined to believe certain 666 00:28:33,220 --> 00:28:30,289 things or they're contemplating certain 667 00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:33,230 actions and they get some sort of 668 00:28:38,499 --> 00:28:35,450 communication whether it's genuine or 669 00:28:43,090 --> 00:28:38,509 not that validates that inclination and 670 00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:43,100 then away they go they seem to lack some 671 00:28:49,119 --> 00:28:46,730 common sense for example committing 672 00:28:51,789 --> 00:28:49,129 murder because spirits told you in a 673 00:28:54,129 --> 00:28:51,799 message that that was a good thing to do 674 00:28:57,039 --> 00:28:54,139 are we saying then rosemary that the 675 00:29:00,549 --> 00:28:57,049 Ouija board becomes the excuse for the 676 00:29:02,590 --> 00:29:00,559 crime it does yes and in fact as in some 677 00:29:05,440 --> 00:29:02,600 of the cases people have testified in 678 00:29:07,299 --> 00:29:05,450 court that the Ouija board was to blame 679 00:29:09,009 --> 00:29:07,309 for their actions and of course this 680 00:29:11,979 --> 00:29:09,019 doesn't sit well with the judge and jury 681 00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:11,989 well why would you believe it right well 682 00:29:15,730 --> 00:29:13,610 exactly and in 683 00:29:17,770 --> 00:29:15,740 there was one case in the early 20th 684 00:29:21,610 --> 00:29:17,780 century wasn't a murder case but it was 685 00:29:23,890 --> 00:29:21,620 about an allegation of theft and this 686 00:29:25,270 --> 00:29:23,900 crazy case this couple goes away when 687 00:29:27,010 --> 00:29:25,280 they come home and they find that their 688 00:29:29,620 --> 00:29:27,020 pantry has been raided of stuff like 689 00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:29,630 sugar and you know nothing major is 690 00:29:33,760 --> 00:29:31,730 taken from the house just sugar and 691 00:29:37,210 --> 00:29:33,770 there's some food stuff and they 692 00:29:40,180 --> 00:29:37,220 immediately accused some neighbor of 693 00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:40,190 doing this and start spreading the word 694 00:29:44,470 --> 00:29:42,170 that this woman is a thief and broke 695 00:29:48,070 --> 00:29:44,480 into their house and whatnot and she got 696 00:29:50,650 --> 00:29:48,080 very upset and wanted a retraction and 697 00:29:54,720 --> 00:29:50,660 they wouldn't they wouldn't do that so 698 00:29:57,310 --> 00:29:54,730 she sued them and the judge ruled that 699 00:30:00,010 --> 00:29:57,320 the Ouija board you know could not be 700 00:30:01,690 --> 00:30:00,020 held accountable because you know the 701 00:30:04,140 --> 00:30:01,700 woman consulted a Ouija board and the 702 00:30:07,240 --> 00:30:04,150 Ouija board said yes the neighbor did it 703 00:30:09,190 --> 00:30:07,250 and the judge said you know that's 704 00:30:11,440 --> 00:30:09,200 ridiculous and just you know threw it 705 00:30:14,350 --> 00:30:11,450 out of court we have some frightening 706 00:30:16,510 --> 00:30:14,360 cases where juries have have consulted 707 00:30:19,030 --> 00:30:16,520 Ouija boards and there was a case in 708 00:30:22,300 --> 00:30:19,040 England from the 1990s a murder case it 709 00:30:26,250 --> 00:30:22,310 was a double homicide and a man had 710 00:30:28,780 --> 00:30:26,260 killed an insurance agent and his wife 711 00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:28,790 the charge was and he had done it for 712 00:30:33,150 --> 00:30:30,650 money because the the man was known to 713 00:30:35,980 --> 00:30:33,160 keep sums of money in the house and 714 00:30:37,840 --> 00:30:35,990 while the jury was deliberating they 715 00:30:41,050 --> 00:30:37,850 apparently had some drinks and they're 716 00:30:43,330 --> 00:30:41,060 sequestered hotel and one of them got 717 00:30:47,650 --> 00:30:43,340 out a Ouija board and asked whether or 718 00:30:49,660 --> 00:30:47,660 not the the victim was early the accused 719 00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:49,670 was guilty and the board said vote 720 00:30:56,910 --> 00:30:53,690 guilty so they did and somehow this got 721 00:30:59,380 --> 00:30:56,920 out into the media and of course the the 722 00:31:02,080 --> 00:30:59,390 defending lawyer demanded a retrial 723 00:31:05,100 --> 00:31:02,090 which which he got he was reconvicted 724 00:31:07,210 --> 00:31:05,110 but it's kind of scary to think that 725 00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:07,220 people who hold that kind of 726 00:31:13,330 --> 00:31:10,370 responsibility might be using any kind 727 00:31:14,830 --> 00:31:13,340 of divination device to ask whether or 728 00:31:17,020 --> 00:31:14,840 not someone is innocent or guilty rather 729 00:31:20,440 --> 00:31:17,030 than letting the evidence speak don't 730 00:31:24,130 --> 00:31:20,450 use tarot cards and who knows 731 00:31:25,120 --> 00:31:24,140 good in that if the lawyers can't 732 00:31:27,460 --> 00:31:25,130 convince you and you have to go to 733 00:31:29,710 --> 00:31:27,470 something like that and avoid it's time 734 00:31:32,520 --> 00:31:29,720 for a new trial well if the lawyer says 735 00:31:34,750 --> 00:31:32,530 if the gloves don't fit you must acquit 736 00:31:36,700 --> 00:31:34,760 what's your next step in that trial 737 00:31:40,510 --> 00:31:36,710 while you go get the out the Ouija board 738 00:31:42,820 --> 00:31:40,520 to break it as a Ouija board isn't there 739 00:31:45,370 --> 00:31:42,830 was another case one of my favorite 740 00:31:47,710 --> 00:31:45,380 cases was from the 1930s a midwestern 741 00:31:50,050 --> 00:31:47,720 case where a woman suspected that her 742 00:31:52,030 --> 00:31:50,060 husband was having an affair and so she 743 00:31:54,400 --> 00:31:52,040 gets out the Ouija board and the Ouija 744 00:31:56,320 --> 00:31:54,410 board says yes man's having an affair 745 00:32:01,090 --> 00:31:56,330 with a woman next door just as she 746 00:32:03,640 --> 00:32:01,100 suspected and so she's no upset about 747 00:32:06,070 --> 00:32:03,650 this and think that you know this is the 748 00:32:09,490 --> 00:32:06,080 absolute truth so she gets her daughter 749 00:32:12,850 --> 00:32:09,500 from her first marriage and she and and 750 00:32:14,950 --> 00:32:12,860 her daughter attack the husband his name 751 00:32:17,590 --> 00:32:14,960 is Herbert they they attack him chained 752 00:32:19,780 --> 00:32:17,600 him to a bed and start torturing him 753 00:32:22,510 --> 00:32:19,790 they beat him with a whip they burn his 754 00:32:24,940 --> 00:32:22,520 feet with a hot poker they stabbed him 755 00:32:27,490 --> 00:32:24,950 with a dagger to get him to confess that 756 00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:27,500 he had this affair he kept insisting no 757 00:32:31,540 --> 00:32:28,730 he hasn't 758 00:32:34,300 --> 00:32:31,550 they starved him and kept torturing him 759 00:32:38,620 --> 00:32:34,310 till finally he signed a confession just 760 00:32:41,170 --> 00:32:38,630 to get them to stop so they were you 761 00:32:43,510 --> 00:32:41,180 know momentarily appeased and then he 762 00:32:45,250 --> 00:32:43,520 found his moment more or less we've been 763 00:32:47,620 --> 00:32:45,260 waiting for and he managed to escape 764 00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:47,630 well they caught him and dragged him 765 00:32:51,000 --> 00:32:48,890 back and chained into the bed and 766 00:32:54,340 --> 00:32:51,010 started the whole thing over again and 767 00:32:56,230 --> 00:32:54,350 this time he was when he got free he was 768 00:32:59,770 --> 00:32:56,240 so enraged himself that he killed his 769 00:33:02,320 --> 00:32:59,780 wife no maybe he wasn't guilty the first 770 00:33:05,380 --> 00:33:02,330 time but he got so enraged that he did 771 00:33:09,010 --> 00:33:05,390 something bad so Herbert husband then 772 00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:09,020 was charged with murder and his story 773 00:33:14,530 --> 00:33:11,770 just you know made incredible headlines 774 00:33:17,260 --> 00:33:14,540 and he said there was no affair he said 775 00:33:19,030 --> 00:33:17,270 I just confessed that to get them to 776 00:33:22,030 --> 00:33:19,040 stop while all charges were dropped 777 00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:22,040 against him but here were these two 778 00:33:26,110 --> 00:33:24,530 women torturing this man because the 779 00:33:29,350 --> 00:33:26,120 spirit said that he was having an affair 780 00:33:31,470 --> 00:33:29,360 which he probably wasn't anyway the 781 00:33:33,720 --> 00:33:31,480 spirits right 782 00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:33,730 well that our problem I think when you 783 00:33:38,310 --> 00:33:36,010 have a device like this you could use it 784 00:33:41,279 --> 00:33:38,320 as an excuse attention I think that's 785 00:33:43,529 --> 00:33:41,289 what happens in these extreme cases now 786 00:33:48,769 --> 00:33:43,539 there's another very peculiar case from 787 00:33:51,899 --> 00:33:48,779 the 1990s early 1990s where a group of 788 00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:51,909 intelligence military intelligence oh 789 00:33:58,919 --> 00:33:55,570 the Gulf mouth of course that they went 790 00:34:00,870 --> 00:33:58,929 AWOL because they got mez they started 791 00:34:04,139 --> 00:34:00,880 using the Ouija board and the spirit 792 00:34:06,419 --> 00:34:04,149 started telling them allegedly that they 793 00:34:09,210 --> 00:34:06,429 were destined to be some sort of saviors 794 00:34:11,940 --> 00:34:09,220 and heralds of the Apocalypse the you 795 00:34:13,339 --> 00:34:11,950 know the coming trials and tribulations 796 00:34:15,780 --> 00:34:13,349 and they had to get out of the military 797 00:34:17,310 --> 00:34:15,790 well they couldn't get regular 798 00:34:20,460 --> 00:34:17,320 discharges there was no way they could 799 00:34:24,629 --> 00:34:20,470 get out so they went AWOL and they 800 00:34:27,359 --> 00:34:24,639 managed to get to Florida where the jig 801 00:34:30,569 --> 00:34:27,369 was up when one of them got arrested for 802 00:34:32,460 --> 00:34:30,579 a broken taillight and that's what got 803 00:34:34,369 --> 00:34:32,470 the unraveled the whole thing they were 804 00:34:37,639 --> 00:34:34,379 all rounded up and so there they were 805 00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:37,649 you know they had deserted the army 806 00:34:43,559 --> 00:34:40,450 because they were convinced by these 807 00:34:46,020 --> 00:34:43,569 messages that they had a bigger mission 808 00:34:47,809 --> 00:34:46,030 yeah Vance Davis so it's very 809 00:34:52,290 --> 00:34:47,819 interesting story he went on to become 810 00:34:54,839 --> 00:34:52,300 Richard Hoagland Masonic expert Masonic 811 00:34:56,970 --> 00:34:54,849 historian and expert and actually 812 00:34:59,010 --> 00:34:56,980 co-presented with Hogan right after the 813 00:35:01,140 --> 00:34:59,020 Phoenix lights at a huge gathering down 814 00:35:03,240 --> 00:35:01,150 in the-- well I always found it very 815 00:35:04,859 --> 00:35:03,250 interesting that that Richard Hogan 816 00:35:07,920 --> 00:35:04,869 should pick one of the Gulf Breeze sixes 817 00:35:10,470 --> 00:35:07,930 and and you know put the the tag of 818 00:35:12,059 --> 00:35:10,480 Masonic scholar on you know charge an 819 00:35:14,609 --> 00:35:12,069 incredible amount of money per ticket 820 00:35:17,839 --> 00:35:14,619 and pack an auditorium full of people to 821 00:35:20,609 --> 00:35:17,849 listen to an a Ouija board a wielding 822 00:35:23,490 --> 00:35:20,619 ex-military intelligence guy just I 823 00:35:26,069 --> 00:35:23,500 don't know it's quite quite an a pretty 824 00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:26,079 interesting story and one that I think 825 00:35:30,329 --> 00:35:28,810 has been overlooked and in ufology to 826 00:35:33,270 --> 00:35:30,339 some degree because there's a lot of UFO 827 00:35:36,300 --> 00:35:33,280 connection type stuff that is involved 828 00:35:39,740 --> 00:35:36,310 there how about some other accounts well 829 00:35:44,400 --> 00:35:39,750 we have accounts of people leaving 830 00:35:45,180 --> 00:35:44,410 fortunes to certain individuals because 831 00:35:49,250 --> 00:35:45,190 spirits 832 00:35:54,359 --> 00:35:49,260 told them to do so there was a woman who 833 00:35:56,970 --> 00:35:54,369 left a sizable inheritance to an entity 834 00:35:58,770 --> 00:35:56,980 or personality that what she was 835 00:36:00,480 --> 00:35:58,780 communicating with on the Ouija board 836 00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:00,490 that there was no evidence that this 837 00:36:08,010 --> 00:36:02,650 person existed in the physical at all 838 00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:08,020 and yet she considered him confidant or 839 00:36:12,960 --> 00:36:11,290 companion or whatever and left all this 840 00:36:15,599 --> 00:36:12,970 money to him and and of course the 841 00:36:17,430 --> 00:36:15,609 surviving relatives contested the will 842 00:36:18,990 --> 00:36:17,440 and I will have to find out what 843 00:36:21,109 --> 00:36:19,000 happened when they contested the will 844 00:36:23,730 --> 00:36:21,119 because she left to someone who 845 00:36:25,559 --> 00:36:23,740 theoretically did not exist and this 846 00:36:27,450 --> 00:36:25,569 isn't quite the same as perhaps leaving 847 00:36:29,940 --> 00:36:27,460 it to the family pet at least there 848 00:36:32,069 --> 00:36:29,950 you'll have someone who is taking care 849 00:36:33,900 --> 00:36:32,079 of the pet and probably getting a lot of 850 00:36:35,790 --> 00:36:33,910 money to do that we are talking about 851 00:36:37,680 --> 00:36:35,800 Ouija boards and the ramifications with 852 00:36:40,960 --> 00:36:37,690 rosemary ellen guiley with gene and 853 00:36:40,970 --> 00:36:48,400 [Music] 854 00:36:52,120 --> 00:36:51,130 are you tired of searching for great 855 00:36:55,330 --> 00:36:52,130 talk-radio 856 00:36:59,920 --> 00:36:55,340 more important searching overruled we 857 00:37:01,720 --> 00:36:59,930 are the GCM radio 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financially destroy any family 928 00:40:11,660 --> 00:40:09,330 we simply cannot afford to get sick the 929 00:40:13,130 --> 00:40:11,670 only option is to stay healthy Americans 930 00:40:15,170 --> 00:40:13,140 are learning that ill health is not 931 00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:15,180 caused by a deficiency of drugs it's 932 00:40:19,640 --> 00:40:17,010 usually the results of a deficiency of 933 00:40:22,520 --> 00:40:19,650 minerals vitamins proper nutrition and 934 00:40:24,410 --> 00:40:22,530 exercise you Toby silver comm offers 935 00:40:26,410 --> 00:40:24,420 colloidal silver and healing protocols 936 00:40:29,720 --> 00:40:26,420 for vaccine and radiation poisoning 937 00:40:31,430 --> 00:40:29,730 arthritis insomnia and more if you're 938 00:40:34,339 --> 00:40:31,440 sick of unconstitutional government 939 00:40:36,620 --> 00:40:34,349 mandates then stand up now and say no 940 00:40:38,660 --> 00:40:36,630 the time is growing short to put this 941 00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:38,670 evil genie back in its bottle join 942 00:40:42,470 --> 00:40:40,290 utopia silver in promoting good health 943 00:40:45,260 --> 00:40:42,480 and fighting for our god-given health 944 00:40:46,220 --> 00:40:45,270 care rights visit utopia silver calm 945 00:40:52,670 --> 00:40:46,230 ut-oh 946 00:40:55,370 --> 00:40:52,680 VI a silver calm or call 888 213 43:38 947 00:41:03,490 --> 00:40:55,380 that's eight eight eight two one three 948 00:41:08,990 --> 00:41:05,270 this is Jacques Vallee 949 00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:09,000 you're listening to the podcast the gold 950 00:41:14,920 --> 00:41:10,970 standard of mobile radio 951 00:41:21,200 --> 00:41:17,840 so Chris tells me it came pretty close 952 00:41:23,630 --> 00:41:21,210 over there a lightning storm blowin oh 953 00:41:26,330 --> 00:41:23,640 it's really coming down out there and 954 00:41:28,670 --> 00:41:26,340 you love the monsoon right huh yeah oh 955 00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:28,680 yeah yes the environment hey rain in the 956 00:41:33,260 --> 00:41:30,450 desert it's a good thing Jean you know 957 00:41:35,540 --> 00:41:33,270 yes we got some pretty crazy storms in 958 00:41:38,600 --> 00:41:35,550 Phoenix those of you who don't live in 959 00:41:40,970 --> 00:41:38,610 Phoenix which is 99.99% of our audience 960 00:41:42,650 --> 00:41:40,980 will look up the weather forecast and 961 00:41:44,870 --> 00:41:42,660 the results we have rosemary ellen 962 00:41:47,330 --> 00:41:44,880 guiley who is another part of the 963 00:41:48,080 --> 00:41:47,340 country the book is called vici gone 964 00:41:50,060 --> 00:41:48,090 wild 965 00:41:54,230 --> 00:41:50,070 do you get a lot of rain where you are 966 00:42:01,660 --> 00:41:54,240 now well I'm in Seattle and it's been 967 00:42:08,570 --> 00:42:05,060 isn't that wild I can hear that on my 968 00:42:10,070 --> 00:42:08,580 end yeah it's blue it's coming down you 969 00:42:12,770 --> 00:42:10,080 know and then a couple hundred yards and 970 00:42:14,810 --> 00:42:12,780 all over this is great oh maybe I'll 971 00:42:16,250 --> 00:42:14,820 start glowing and maybe all of a sudden 972 00:42:18,410 --> 00:42:16,260 I'll start speaking in tongues and we'll 973 00:42:20,480 --> 00:42:18,420 have to take notes and you can start 974 00:42:22,940 --> 00:42:20,490 asking me questions and I'll come up 975 00:42:26,060 --> 00:42:22,950 with answers well we can communicate 976 00:42:29,600 --> 00:42:26,070 with Chris with the Ouija board well 977 00:42:31,550 --> 00:42:29,610 only if he crosses over all right so 978 00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:31,560 let's go back to this crazy case that 979 00:42:37,550 --> 00:42:32,970 you told us about in our last segment 980 00:42:40,580 --> 00:42:37,560 where someone leaves the fortune or 981 00:42:44,120 --> 00:42:40,590 whatever the inheritance is to someone 982 00:42:46,220 --> 00:42:44,130 who she contacted from the Ouija board 983 00:42:48,920 --> 00:42:46,230 and of course the relatives contested 984 00:42:50,240 --> 00:42:48,930 this now I can always use that excuse of 985 00:42:52,370 --> 00:42:50,250 course the fact that I got very little 986 00:42:54,380 --> 00:42:52,380 money from my brother when he died it 987 00:42:56,150 --> 00:42:54,390 may be because he either he hated me 988 00:42:58,520 --> 00:42:56,160 didn't think I deserved the money 989 00:43:01,850 --> 00:42:58,530 whereas Ouija board told him that I'll 990 00:43:07,460 --> 00:43:01,860 use that excuse well this case occurred 991 00:43:10,910 --> 00:43:07,470 in the nineteen fifties and well that's 992 00:43:11,390 --> 00:43:10,920 when she died she died around the 1955 993 00:43:14,510 --> 00:43:11,400 or so 994 00:43:18,140 --> 00:43:14,520 name was Helen and she married a wealthy 995 00:43:20,359 --> 00:43:18,150 insurance broker and had about a hundred 996 00:43:22,220 --> 00:43:20,369 and seventy eighty thousand dollars to 997 00:43:26,539 --> 00:43:22,230 her name when she died but she'd been 998 00:43:28,789 --> 00:43:26,549 fascinated by spiritualism and earlier 999 00:43:31,069 --> 00:43:28,799 in the 20th century she communicated 1000 00:43:33,380 --> 00:43:31,079 with this entity or personality who 1001 00:43:36,440 --> 00:43:33,390 identified himself as John Gail Forbes 1002 00:43:37,279 --> 00:43:36,450 and they became quite close through the 1003 00:43:39,710 --> 00:43:37,289 Ouija board 1004 00:43:41,750 --> 00:43:39,720 when Helen died she specified in her 1005 00:43:43,789 --> 00:43:41,760 will that her money was to go to this 1006 00:43:47,089 --> 00:43:43,799 John Gail Forbes or if he could not be 1007 00:43:49,370 --> 00:43:47,099 found to his heirs well now he had told 1008 00:43:51,859 --> 00:43:49,380 her at one point in his communications 1009 00:43:53,990 --> 00:43:51,869 that he was in the spirit world himself 1010 00:43:57,769 --> 00:43:54,000 but there was no evidence that this 1011 00:44:00,049 --> 00:43:57,779 person ever existed and he could not be 1012 00:44:04,220 --> 00:44:00,059 found there were no records of any areas 1013 00:44:05,750 --> 00:44:04,230 of his and so all of her relatives who 1014 00:44:08,000 --> 00:44:05,760 got cut out of the will we're very 1015 00:44:10,640 --> 00:44:08,010 unhappy about this and they had to go to 1016 00:44:14,900 --> 00:44:10,650 court to contest the will she was 1017 00:44:16,640 --> 00:44:14,910 eventually ruled posthumously to be have 1018 00:44:19,750 --> 00:44:16,650 been mentally incompetent when she made 1019 00:44:24,099 --> 00:44:19,760 out the will and the money was split up 1020 00:44:26,569 --> 00:44:24,109 about nine ways to surviving heirs and 1021 00:44:29,260 --> 00:44:26,579 some of them lived in Washington state 1022 00:44:31,370 --> 00:44:29,270 in fact so they were happy about that 1023 00:44:34,549 --> 00:44:31,380 resolution but what was going through 1024 00:44:37,880 --> 00:44:34,559 her head to leave money to someone that 1025 00:44:41,539 --> 00:44:37,890 she didn't even know ever existed right 1026 00:44:43,539 --> 00:44:41,549 well what was the motivation she must 1027 00:44:47,000 --> 00:44:43,549 have really had quite a torrid affair 1028 00:44:53,000 --> 00:44:47,010 with the spirit world to make that 1029 00:44:56,269 --> 00:44:53,010 decision that seems well he he he wrote 1030 00:45:00,200 --> 00:44:56,279 her poetry the Spirit transmitted poetry 1031 00:45:02,180 --> 00:45:00,210 to her and this was while her own 1032 00:45:04,099 --> 00:45:02,190 husband was alive in fact in fact her 1033 00:45:06,349 --> 00:45:04,109 husband got very offended at these 1034 00:45:09,260 --> 00:45:06,359 communications like she had some sort of 1035 00:45:12,799 --> 00:45:09,270 you know suitor who was competing with 1036 00:45:15,380 --> 00:45:12,809 him for for his wife but she was quite 1037 00:45:18,769 --> 00:45:15,390 enamored with this and carried on with 1038 00:45:20,390 --> 00:45:18,779 it even after her husband died well 1039 00:45:22,279 --> 00:45:20,400 maybe he should have taken them taking 1040 00:45:24,660 --> 00:45:22,289 the hint and started writing poetry for 1041 00:45:28,030 --> 00:45:24,670 his wife or at least finding someone 1042 00:45:31,240 --> 00:45:28,040 or maybe he divorced her a long time ago 1043 00:45:34,420 --> 00:45:31,250 because she was wacko her broken to the 1044 00:45:38,800 --> 00:45:34,430 board or something but we found I got 1045 00:45:42,640 --> 00:45:38,810 your Ouija board right here crack well 1046 00:45:45,130 --> 00:45:42,650 we laugh but we also found cases where 1047 00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:45,140 people tried to dispose of the board and 1048 00:45:54,430 --> 00:45:49,130 had a difficult time doing so Oh pray 1049 00:45:57,340 --> 00:45:54,440 tell well I'm the case that I called a 1050 00:45:59,620 --> 00:45:57,350 meeting immediately to mind was given to 1051 00:46:02,770 --> 00:45:59,630 me by a researcher I know and and I do 1052 00:46:05,080 --> 00:46:02,780 want to stress that some of the stories 1053 00:46:07,420 --> 00:46:05,090 were told to me came from colleagues in 1054 00:46:09,010 --> 00:46:07,430 the paranormal field people that I know 1055 00:46:11,590 --> 00:46:09,020 are very well grounded and know the 1056 00:46:13,810 --> 00:46:11,600 ropes about the paranormal and yet 1057 00:46:16,120 --> 00:46:13,820 they've still had strange experiences 1058 00:46:18,400 --> 00:46:16,130 and this came from Erika Altman who 1059 00:46:21,100 --> 00:46:18,410 founded the Pennsylvania Bigfoot Society 1060 00:46:23,950 --> 00:46:21,110 and I've known Eric a good long time and 1061 00:46:26,440 --> 00:46:23,960 when he was in college he was dating a 1062 00:46:28,900 --> 00:46:26,450 girl who got wrapped up in the Ouija 1063 00:46:31,060 --> 00:46:28,910 board with her friends and it followed 1064 00:46:33,460 --> 00:46:31,070 the classic pattern of interesting funny 1065 00:46:35,560 --> 00:46:33,470 entertaining communications that 1066 00:46:37,000 --> 00:46:35,570 suddenly took a very dark turn and 1067 00:46:39,850 --> 00:46:37,010 everybody started getting frightened 1068 00:46:41,380 --> 00:46:39,860 because the board was telling them nasty 1069 00:46:44,680 --> 00:46:41,390 things and that they were going to die 1070 00:46:46,720 --> 00:46:44,690 and they were having nightmares well she 1071 00:46:51,070 --> 00:46:46,730 wanted to get rid of the board so one 1072 00:46:54,070 --> 00:46:51,080 night he and his girlfriend put the 1073 00:46:55,030 --> 00:46:54,080 board in a bag the board and a plant and 1074 00:46:57,220 --> 00:46:55,040 the planchette 1075 00:46:59,200 --> 00:46:57,230 put some rocks in the bag and drove out 1076 00:47:01,900 --> 00:46:59,210 to a lake it was wintertime 1077 00:47:04,750 --> 00:47:01,910 and they were in the dark and he tossed 1078 00:47:07,300 --> 00:47:04,760 this bag onto the lake he said I heard 1079 00:47:09,190 --> 00:47:07,310 the ice break and the bag go through and 1080 00:47:12,250 --> 00:47:09,200 so he gets back in the car and they're 1081 00:47:15,190 --> 00:47:12,260 leaving the scene and his girlfriend 1082 00:47:17,200 --> 00:47:15,200 starts freaking out because she finds 1083 00:47:19,990 --> 00:47:17,210 rattling around under the front seat the 1084 00:47:22,030 --> 00:47:20,000 planchette which was supposed to be in 1085 00:47:24,490 --> 00:47:22,040 the bag that had gone into the lake and 1086 00:47:26,590 --> 00:47:24,500 Eric said I put them in in the bag I 1087 00:47:29,620 --> 00:47:26,600 know they went in the bag and yet here's 1088 00:47:32,320 --> 00:47:29,630 the planchette so he grabs a planchette 1089 00:47:34,420 --> 00:47:32,330 breaks it up throws it out the window so 1090 00:47:36,640 --> 00:47:34,430 they go back she goes back to her dorm 1091 00:47:38,030 --> 00:47:36,650 room and then the next day he gets a 1092 00:47:40,550 --> 00:47:38,040 frantic call 1093 00:47:42,440 --> 00:47:40,560 she's sobbing and crying he goes over to 1094 00:47:47,030 --> 00:47:42,450 see her and what's sitting outside the 1095 00:47:49,730 --> 00:47:47,040 door of her dorm room but this bag from 1096 00:47:52,190 --> 00:47:49,740 the lake with the Ouija board in it and 1097 00:47:53,750 --> 00:47:52,200 at first he thought oh come on you know 1098 00:47:55,460 --> 00:47:53,760 you and your friends you've got to be 1099 00:47:57,650 --> 00:47:55,470 playing a trick on me somebody drove up 1100 00:48:00,740 --> 00:47:57,660 there and somehow went out to the middle 1101 00:48:03,200 --> 00:48:00,750 of this icebound lake and and retrieved 1102 00:48:04,460 --> 00:48:03,210 this thing he you know we know how that 1103 00:48:06,890 --> 00:48:04,470 could happen but that was the only thing 1104 00:48:09,260 --> 00:48:06,900 you could think of and she insisted no 1105 00:48:10,670 --> 00:48:09,270 that it was sitting there when she got 1106 00:48:12,800 --> 00:48:10,680 up in the morning and opened the door 1107 00:48:15,740 --> 00:48:12,810 she found the bag outside of her door 1108 00:48:18,380 --> 00:48:15,750 this is like the classic horror movie it 1109 00:48:21,920 --> 00:48:18,390 is sure and so this time he broke the 1110 00:48:23,960 --> 00:48:21,930 board into pieces and threw it into a 1111 00:48:26,840 --> 00:48:23,970 garbage disposal he said I never saw the 1112 00:48:28,820 --> 00:48:26,850 board again but she and her friends who 1113 00:48:31,850 --> 00:48:28,830 had been using the Ouija board continued 1114 00:48:33,290 --> 00:48:31,860 to have some problems with nightmares 1115 00:48:38,180 --> 00:48:33,300 and they felt something was watching 1116 00:48:39,800 --> 00:48:38,190 them and after some time he the two of 1117 00:48:42,350 --> 00:48:39,810 them stopped seeing each other so he 1118 00:48:45,200 --> 00:48:42,360 didn't know exactly how long it took for 1119 00:48:46,880 --> 00:48:45,210 this to resolve but we've had other 1120 00:48:49,550 --> 00:48:46,890 cases like that where people have had 1121 00:48:51,710 --> 00:48:49,560 difficulty disposing of the board now 1122 00:48:53,540 --> 00:48:51,720 the story's about all I cried to burn 1123 00:48:57,920 --> 00:48:53,550 the board and it wouldn't burn so it 1124 00:49:01,760 --> 00:48:57,930 must be demonic those are fairly 1125 00:49:03,740 --> 00:49:01,770 explainable if they attempted to destroy 1126 00:49:06,740 --> 00:49:03,750 one of the old boards made out of 1127 00:49:09,800 --> 00:49:06,750 masonite now they're just kind of a very 1128 00:49:13,250 --> 00:49:09,810 thin cardboard but the masonite resists 1129 00:49:15,500 --> 00:49:13,260 burning and you wouldn't be able to get 1130 00:49:17,450 --> 00:49:15,510 that to burn very well in a fire so it's 1131 00:49:19,730 --> 00:49:17,460 not due to any psychic phenomena it's 1132 00:49:23,540 --> 00:49:19,740 just the physical property yes in that 1133 00:49:25,910 --> 00:49:23,550 particular case now I had a case where I 1134 00:49:28,700 --> 00:49:25,920 wasn't trying to get rid of a board but 1135 00:49:31,010 --> 00:49:28,710 I have about seven or eight boards and I 1136 00:49:33,470 --> 00:49:31,020 look for them and you know thrift stores 1137 00:49:38,390 --> 00:49:33,480 and yard sales and occasionally online I 1138 00:49:40,970 --> 00:49:38,400 like the older boards and I board where 1139 00:49:43,730 --> 00:49:40,980 the planchette went missing for about 1140 00:49:46,790 --> 00:49:43,740 two years and I call it my haunted board 1141 00:49:49,930 --> 00:49:46,800 and it was missing it went missing oh 1142 00:49:53,140 --> 00:49:49,940 and it disappeared 1143 00:49:55,210 --> 00:49:53,150 and I was just about to at the point 1144 00:49:57,790 --> 00:49:55,220 where I thought well I might as well see 1145 00:50:01,330 --> 00:49:57,800 if I can buy a spare planchette to 1146 00:50:04,260 --> 00:50:01,340 replace this one and it reappeared in 1147 00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:04,270 the box I put the board away in storage 1148 00:50:10,180 --> 00:50:06,410 because it didn't have its planchette 1149 00:50:12,430 --> 00:50:10,190 and then when I got it out and about two 1150 00:50:14,350 --> 00:50:12,440 years had elapsed from the time the 1151 00:50:16,810 --> 00:50:14,360 planchette had disappeared and the 1152 00:50:19,600 --> 00:50:16,820 planchette was in the ball in the box 1153 00:50:21,610 --> 00:50:19,610 with the board I have a companion or 1154 00:50:24,340 --> 00:50:21,620 someone who might have been playing a 1155 00:50:27,010 --> 00:50:24,350 practical joke on you know I had been 1156 00:50:29,560 --> 00:50:27,020 living by myself and I discovered it 1157 00:50:31,720 --> 00:50:29,570 when I moved because I put the board 1158 00:50:35,220 --> 00:50:31,730 away because missing the planchette I 1159 00:50:37,660 --> 00:50:35,230 wasn't going to use it and I moved and 1160 00:50:40,680 --> 00:50:37,670 that's when I got the board out to pack 1161 00:50:46,090 --> 00:50:40,690 it up and everything was there the 1162 00:50:47,410 --> 00:50:46,100 pointer and the board I have no 1163 00:50:49,360 --> 00:50:47,420 explanation for it 1164 00:50:51,970 --> 00:50:49,370 I'm just saying whoa because I don't 1165 00:50:54,880 --> 00:50:51,980 know what to say about this because we 1166 00:50:57,040 --> 00:50:54,890 know that you're telling us something 1167 00:50:58,540 --> 00:50:57,050 that happened to you and I don't know 1168 00:51:00,490 --> 00:50:58,550 what kind of explanation I think some 1169 00:51:02,080 --> 00:51:00,500 people in our forums would like to make 1170 00:51:03,850 --> 00:51:02,090 up an explanation or maybe that you're 1171 00:51:06,340 --> 00:51:03,860 just putting us on but you're not the 1172 00:51:08,590 --> 00:51:06,350 kind of person who just puts them on 1173 00:51:10,600 --> 00:51:08,600 you're not like a Jim Mosley or someone 1174 00:51:12,160 --> 00:51:10,610 you're somebody who was very serious 1175 00:51:13,510 --> 00:51:12,170 about stuff like that not if you don't 1176 00:51:15,100 --> 00:51:13,520 have a sense of humor and don't laugh 1177 00:51:17,140 --> 00:51:15,110 but you know when it comes to this 1178 00:51:18,400 --> 00:51:17,150 subject it's a serious thing we have 1179 00:51:21,010 --> 00:51:18,410 rosemary ellen guiley 1180 00:51:24,010 --> 00:51:21,020 and she wrote this book with Rick Fisher 1181 00:51:26,530 --> 00:51:24,020 called we jug gone wild it in weather is 1182 00:51:28,690 --> 00:51:26,540 wild in Arizona with gene and Chris 1183 00:51:31,050 --> 00:51:28,700 until the lightning strikes you're in 1184 00:51:38,220 --> 00:51:31,060 the archive 1185 00:51:45,010 --> 00:51:41,800 the gzn radio network providing the 1186 00:51:49,660 --> 00:51:45,020 world with hard-hitting talk radio G C 1187 00:51:51,370 --> 00:51:49,670 and great talk radio starts here hi this 1188 00:51:53,830 --> 00:51:51,380 is Ted Anderson if you'd like to listen 1189 00:51:54,370 --> 00:51:53,840 to GCN programs on the goal I have great 1190 00:51:56,440 --> 00:51:54,380 news 1191 00:51:58,090 --> 00:51:56,450 gzn has created a Droid and iPhone 1192 00:52:00,400 --> 00:51:58,100 application and it's free 1193 00:52:02,260 --> 00:52:00,410 just as easy as going to GC and live.com 1194 00:52:03,880 --> 00:52:02,270 click on the banner and download before 1195 00:52:06,130 --> 00:52:03,890 you know it you'll be listening to your 1196 00:52:07,570 --> 00:52:06,140 favorite hard-hitting GCN shows live 1197 00:52:10,480 --> 00:52:07,580 around two men right on your dryer 1198 00:52:12,430 --> 00:52:10,490 iPhone 24/7 and on the go so download 1199 00:52:14,500 --> 00:52:12,440 the Droid an iPhone app free by clicking 1200 00:52:16,180 --> 00:52:14,510 on the banner at juicy and live.com 1201 00:52:18,820 --> 00:52:16,190 thanks again for listening to GC and 1202 00:52:20,650 --> 00:52:18,830 live.com again that's juicy and live.com 1203 00:52:22,150 --> 00:52:20,660 hi this is Ted Anderson have you ever 1204 00:52:23,680 --> 00:52:22,160 wondered why banks stockbrokers 1205 00:52:25,210 --> 00:52:23,690 investment advisors won't talk about 1206 00:52:27,880 --> 00:52:25,220 gold IRA raise they've been available 1207 00:52:29,770 --> 00:52:27,890 since 1986 yet the financial industry 1208 00:52:31,240 --> 00:52:29,780 won't recognize the value of gold for 1209 00:52:33,790 --> 00:52:31,250 your retirement gold has outperformed 1210 00:52:35,560 --> 00:52:33,800 paper investments yet no word about IRAs 1211 00:53:08,230 --> 00:52:35,570 if you would like to have gold for your 1212 00:53:11,200 --> 00:53:08,240 retirement call 806-853-9949 Jeffrey 1213 00:53:13,870 --> 00:53:11,210 products and it's been incredible 37 1214 00:53:16,150 --> 00:53:13,880 pounds in two months our bodies are 1215 00:53:18,130 --> 00:53:16,160 amazing and God gave us an incredible 1216 00:53:20,180 --> 00:53:18,140 gift but if our body doesn't have the 1217 00:53:22,160 --> 00:53:20,190 tools it needs all of 1218 00:53:24,799 --> 00:53:22,170 all of the minerals and the other key 1219 00:53:26,690 --> 00:53:24,809 essential trace elements were not going 1220 00:53:28,579 --> 00:53:26,700 to be healthy folks this hidden hide but 1221 00:53:30,260 --> 00:53:28,589 I only bring to my listeners products 1222 00:53:32,900 --> 00:53:30,270 that I've tried myself that I truly 1223 00:53:35,089 --> 00:53:32,910 believe in and the amazing supplements 1224 00:53:37,039 --> 00:53:35,099 available at Infowars team.com 1225 00:53:38,839 --> 00:53:37,049 have certainly delivered in my life I 1226 00:53:41,150 --> 00:53:38,849 hope you'll give them a try go to info 1227 00:53:43,640 --> 00:53:41,160 wars team comm today and order your 1228 00:53:46,039 --> 00:53:43,650 first canister of beyond tangy tangerine 1229 00:53:48,319 --> 00:53:46,049 complete multivitamin mineral complex 1230 00:53:50,820 --> 00:53:48,329 dietary supplement that's Infowars 1231 00:53:56,220 --> 00:53:50,830 team.com 1232 00:54:04,260 --> 00:53:59,920 welcome back to the para cast the gold 1233 00:54:11,140 --> 00:54:04,270 standard of paranormal radio and now 1234 00:54:13,299 --> 00:54:11,150 here's Jane Steinberg well Chris has 1235 00:54:15,400 --> 00:54:13,309 survived through the second hour of the 1236 00:54:18,130 --> 00:54:15,410 show although it may be touch and go in 1237 00:54:20,200 --> 00:54:18,140 for a while huh hood 1238 00:54:22,839 --> 00:54:20,210 moved away a little bit it was right 1239 00:54:24,549 --> 00:54:22,849 overhead and we were had good large 1240 00:54:26,980 --> 00:54:24,559 pea-sized hail coming down there for a 1241 00:54:29,650 --> 00:54:26,990 while but now it's all gone to Phoenix 1242 00:54:32,799 --> 00:54:29,660 right yeah it's headed your way the book 1243 00:54:34,720 --> 00:54:32,809 is by rosemary ellen guiley and it's 1244 00:54:37,510 --> 00:54:34,730 called weed you gone wild I want to ask 1245 00:54:39,400 --> 00:54:37,520 you rosemary we've heard frightening 1246 00:54:42,819 --> 00:54:39,410 stuff going on here really weird stuff 1247 00:54:45,039 --> 00:54:42,829 we've heard the case of a woman who left 1248 00:54:46,750 --> 00:54:45,049 her fortune to someone some entity or 1249 00:54:50,650 --> 00:54:46,760 being with whom she communicated on the 1250 00:54:54,329 --> 00:54:50,660 Ouija board any real funny stories well 1251 00:54:56,529 --> 00:54:54,339 let's see number of people have gotten 1252 00:55:01,329 --> 00:54:56,539 accurate information about who they're 1253 00:55:03,010 --> 00:55:01,339 going to marry and advise people gotten 1254 00:55:07,690 --> 00:55:03,020 helpful advice oh there was one funny 1255 00:55:10,029 --> 00:55:07,700 story where well this was from earlier 1256 00:55:12,220 --> 00:55:10,039 in the 20th century and a lot of these 1257 00:55:14,190 --> 00:55:12,230 cases would would get reported in the 1258 00:55:16,720 --> 00:55:14,200 news media because the Ouija board was a 1259 00:55:19,000 --> 00:55:16,730 novelty up until about the mid 20th 1260 00:55:22,180 --> 00:55:19,010 century and so a lot of strange cases 1261 00:55:24,420 --> 00:55:22,190 would wind up in the media but she 1262 00:55:26,950 --> 00:55:24,430 called up the police one night and 1263 00:55:29,230 --> 00:55:26,960 insisted that a triple murder had taken 1264 00:55:31,240 --> 00:55:29,240 place in her home and the bodies were in 1265 00:55:33,460 --> 00:55:31,250 the attic so of course the police go 1266 00:55:35,440 --> 00:55:33,470 rushing over to her house they searched 1267 00:55:39,609 --> 00:55:35,450 the entire house including the Attic 1268 00:55:42,370 --> 00:55:39,619 and no bodies not a drop of blood no 1269 00:55:44,710 --> 00:55:42,380 sign of any mayhem of whatsoever and she 1270 00:55:46,150 --> 00:55:44,720 she said well I know that triple murder 1271 00:55:48,760 --> 00:55:46,160 was committed here because the Ouija 1272 00:55:50,529 --> 00:55:48,770 board said so and it's in Sochi you know 1273 00:55:52,180 --> 00:55:50,539 wait the Ouija board says how it had to 1274 00:55:54,970 --> 00:55:52,190 be true there had to be three bodies 1275 00:55:57,700 --> 00:55:54,980 somewhere in the Attic people they just 1276 00:55:59,410 --> 00:55:57,710 I just don't have the sense that they 1277 00:56:01,750 --> 00:55:59,420 were born where they go well there's 1278 00:56:04,390 --> 00:56:01,760 there are some very intriguing cases 1279 00:56:06,520 --> 00:56:04,400 where crimes have been solved we're 1280 00:56:09,010 --> 00:56:06,530 missing persons have been found 1281 00:56:11,980 --> 00:56:09,020 there's a number of interesting examples 1282 00:56:13,960 --> 00:56:11,990 of how that kind of indicates that there 1283 00:56:16,359 --> 00:56:13,970 may be something to this on some level 1284 00:56:17,980 --> 00:56:16,369 that we don't quite understand why don't 1285 00:56:20,140 --> 00:56:17,990 you give us some examples of some of the 1286 00:56:22,510 --> 00:56:20,150 more amazing cases and there are a 1287 00:56:24,190 --> 00:56:22,520 number of them in your book there are 1288 00:56:26,050 --> 00:56:24,200 and this is why we can't be real 1289 00:56:28,420 --> 00:56:26,060 black-and-white about something like a 1290 00:56:30,640 --> 00:56:28,430 Ouija board we can't say it's all bad we 1291 00:56:35,440 --> 00:56:30,650 can't say it's all good there seems to 1292 00:56:38,530 --> 00:56:35,450 be a mix of accuracy of truth and 1293 00:56:41,800 --> 00:56:38,540 helpfulness mixed in with some of these 1294 00:56:44,260 --> 00:56:41,810 wild cases and even the truly 1295 00:56:47,910 --> 00:56:44,270 frightening ones there have been some 1296 00:56:50,710 --> 00:56:47,920 cases where people have gone missing and 1297 00:56:52,900 --> 00:56:50,720 people had consulted the Ouija board and 1298 00:56:56,260 --> 00:56:52,910 they've taken the information to the the 1299 00:56:58,359 --> 00:56:56,270 police and if a law enforcement agencies 1300 00:57:00,220 --> 00:56:58,369 follow through on it that person is 1301 00:57:03,760 --> 00:57:00,230 found there was like a case of a missing 1302 00:57:07,300 --> 00:57:03,770 husband who the woman said my husband's 1303 00:57:10,390 --> 00:57:07,310 been missing and he may have stepped out 1304 00:57:11,710 --> 00:57:10,400 on her who knows and he's in New York 1305 00:57:13,240 --> 00:57:11,720 City I know he's in New York City 1306 00:57:15,339 --> 00:57:13,250 because the Ouija board said he'd went 1307 00:57:16,809 --> 00:57:15,349 to New York and he was indeed found in 1308 00:57:19,630 --> 00:57:16,819 New York right where the read you board 1309 00:57:23,109 --> 00:57:19,640 said he was going to be found there are 1310 00:57:24,970 --> 00:57:23,119 other cases where information has been 1311 00:57:28,720 --> 00:57:24,980 giving about given about missing persons 1312 00:57:30,339 --> 00:57:28,730 and it is not borne out there were 1313 00:57:33,490 --> 00:57:30,349 stories from the early 20th century 1314 00:57:37,270 --> 00:57:33,500 about law enforcement agencies and 1315 00:57:39,690 --> 00:57:37,280 personnel using the Ouija board or at 1316 00:57:42,490 --> 00:57:39,700 least acknowledging it as a source of 1317 00:57:44,460 --> 00:57:42,500 potentially helpful information I don't 1318 00:57:48,250 --> 00:57:44,470 think you'd find anyone wanting to 1319 00:57:50,290 --> 00:57:48,260 acknowledge that today so the 1320 00:57:52,660 --> 00:57:50,300 conventional wisdom has it here that 1321 00:57:54,250 --> 00:57:52,670 it's a plaything when someone moves the 1322 00:57:58,450 --> 00:57:54,260 planchette its subconscious or 1323 00:58:00,460 --> 00:57:58,460 deliberate I'm sorry are you saying in 1324 00:58:05,470 --> 00:58:00,470 every case it's no I'm saying that's 1325 00:58:07,300 --> 00:58:05,480 what people tend to think yes most 1326 00:58:10,690 --> 00:58:07,310 people are going to say that this is a 1327 00:58:13,359 --> 00:58:10,700 product of your imagination you're doing 1328 00:58:16,089 --> 00:58:13,369 it yourself and you just don't realize 1329 00:58:17,680 --> 00:58:16,099 it that's what that's what most skeptics 1330 00:58:20,230 --> 00:58:17,690 would say 1331 00:58:23,650 --> 00:58:20,240 I think that another case can be made 1332 00:58:26,440 --> 00:58:23,660 that there is genuine spirit activity 1333 00:58:28,810 --> 00:58:26,450 through the board and that sometimes 1334 00:58:31,330 --> 00:58:28,820 people do come into contact with 1335 00:58:33,400 --> 00:58:31,340 entities that can read quite a bit of 1336 00:58:35,440 --> 00:58:33,410 havoc with them now one thing I did 1337 00:58:38,040 --> 00:58:35,450 notice when I was interviewing people 1338 00:58:41,200 --> 00:58:38,050 about especially their problematic 1339 00:58:44,140 --> 00:58:41,210 experiences that the people who tend to 1340 00:58:46,870 --> 00:58:44,150 have the most response from the board 1341 00:58:49,690 --> 00:58:46,880 and also the most problems with the 1342 00:58:51,670 --> 00:58:49,700 board are either themselves or working 1343 00:58:54,400 --> 00:58:51,680 it with someone who have natural 1344 00:58:57,640 --> 00:58:54,410 mediumistic ability and sometimes they 1345 00:58:59,740 --> 00:58:57,650 don't realize it especially if they've 1346 00:59:01,630 --> 00:58:59,750 never tried spirit communications before 1347 00:59:04,660 --> 00:59:01,640 but people who have a natural 1348 00:59:07,180 --> 00:59:04,670 mediumistic ability are able to tune in 1349 00:59:08,710 --> 00:59:07,190 to the spirit world much more quickly no 1350 00:59:11,010 --> 00:59:08,720 matter what they use whether it's a 1351 00:59:13,750 --> 00:59:11,020 pendulum a Ouija board a Frank's box 1352 00:59:16,540 --> 00:59:13,760 automatic writing whatever tell our 1353 00:59:20,950 --> 00:59:16,550 listeners one of Frank's boxes Frank's 1354 00:59:23,530 --> 00:59:20,960 boxes are a radio sweep device that scan 1355 00:59:25,720 --> 00:59:23,540 the am usually the am band of radio very 1356 00:59:27,190 --> 00:59:25,730 rapidly like if you had a manual tuner 1357 00:59:29,980 --> 00:59:27,200 and you just kept turning it and turning 1358 00:59:32,140 --> 00:59:29,990 it so that you get a jumble of radio 1359 00:59:35,260 --> 00:59:32,150 broadcast sounds going on in the 1360 00:59:38,050 --> 00:59:35,270 background and this noise matrix like 1361 00:59:40,210 --> 00:59:38,060 white noise seems to facilitate real 1362 00:59:44,020 --> 00:59:40,220 time spirit communication where spirit 1363 00:59:47,020 --> 00:59:44,030 voices are sometimes heard on top of the 1364 00:59:50,200 --> 00:59:47,030 radio scan and it's a thanks box is 1365 00:59:52,330 --> 00:59:50,210 considered to be a spirit communication 1366 00:59:55,240 --> 00:59:52,340 device some people have even called them 1367 00:59:57,580 --> 00:59:55,250 electronic Ouija boards now with the 1368 00:59:59,800 --> 00:59:57,590 Ouija board are we thinking it has a 1369 01:00:03,070 --> 00:59:59,810 power of its own or it's just a focal 1370 01:00:05,380 --> 01:00:03,080 point that you concentrate on it and you 1371 01:00:08,260 --> 01:00:05,390 bring forth whatever internal abilities 1372 01:00:10,210 --> 01:00:08,270 you have Ouija board is a tool just like 1373 01:00:12,910 --> 01:00:10,220 any other spirit communications tool 1374 01:00:17,200 --> 01:00:12,920 it's neutral and I think that the 1375 01:00:19,510 --> 01:00:17,210 results are a product of primarily the 1376 01:00:21,150 --> 01:00:19,520 people operating the board sometimes 1377 01:00:23,500 --> 01:00:21,160 people who are in the group 1378 01:00:26,050 --> 01:00:23,510 participating in the group mind going on 1379 01:00:29,380 --> 01:00:26,060 and the environment because environments 1380 01:00:31,180 --> 01:00:29,390 can be highly charged as well and if 1381 01:00:31,540 --> 01:00:31,190 there's a lot of spirit activity in a 1382 01:00:33,370 --> 01:00:31,550 play 1383 01:00:35,620 --> 01:00:33,380 sir you're in one of these natural 1384 01:00:39,880 --> 01:00:35,630 portal areas that seems to have the 1385 01:00:41,650 --> 01:00:39,890 right and geophysical properties where a 1386 01:00:43,620 --> 01:00:41,660 lot of spirit activity has been 1387 01:00:46,870 --> 01:00:43,630 documented over a long period of time 1388 01:00:49,090 --> 01:00:46,880 those can influence your results as well 1389 01:00:52,420 --> 01:00:49,100 now as you were talking I was looking 1390 01:00:54,460 --> 01:00:52,430 over at amazon.com to see what's 1391 01:00:56,590 --> 01:00:54,470 involved in getting a Ouija board 1392 01:00:58,960 --> 01:00:56,600 they've got one that's glowing the dark 1393 01:01:01,840 --> 01:00:58,970 capability they've gotten one with a 1394 01:01:04,270 --> 01:01:01,850 puck believe it or not they've got a 1395 01:01:06,940 --> 01:01:04,280 large one made of tempered glass a 1396 01:01:09,100 --> 01:01:06,950 tempered glass cutting board okay 1397 01:01:10,870 --> 01:01:09,110 they've got a traditional Parker 1398 01:01:16,690 --> 01:01:10,880 Brothers game and I guess it's a vintage 1399 01:01:19,120 --> 01:01:16,700 one for $225 Wow yes some of the older 1400 01:01:20,860 --> 01:01:19,130 boards sell for quite a good chunk of 1401 01:01:23,670 --> 01:01:20,870 money if you managed to find one from 1402 01:01:27,130 --> 01:01:23,680 the early 20th century those can go for 1403 01:01:29,230 --> 01:01:27,140 way more than that now the one that that 1404 01:01:33,430 --> 01:01:29,240 Hasbro sells now is the glow-in-the-dark 1405 01:01:35,980 --> 01:01:33,440 and the patent on Ouija boards actually 1406 01:01:38,830 --> 01:01:35,990 expired in 1908 I mean anybody can make 1407 01:01:40,690 --> 01:01:38,840 a talking board the generic device where 1408 01:01:42,400 --> 01:01:40,700 you put numbers and letters and the 1409 01:01:45,160 --> 01:01:42,410 selection of words on a board with a 1410 01:01:48,940 --> 01:01:45,170 pointer anybody can do that but it you 1411 01:01:52,720 --> 01:01:48,950 still cannot the name of the legally you 1412 01:01:55,360 --> 01:01:52,730 the name Ouija and the mystifying Oracle 1413 01:01:57,760 --> 01:01:55,370 or trademark as is the design of the 1414 01:02:01,270 --> 01:01:57,770 Ouija board you can't exactly copy that 1415 01:02:03,490 --> 01:02:01,280 now I had one of the original ones the 1416 01:02:05,850 --> 01:02:03,500 mystifying Oracle William Fuld 1417 01:02:09,910 --> 01:02:05,860 talking board set by Parker Brothers and 1418 01:02:14,230 --> 01:02:09,920 you can get one now they have four of 1419 01:02:17,200 --> 01:02:14,240 them for 8955 I missed something here so 1420 01:02:18,880 --> 01:02:17,210 either this one or the Parker Brothers 1421 01:02:23,590 --> 01:02:18,890 game you could possibly make a little 1422 01:02:26,800 --> 01:02:23,600 bit of money they have a mousepad 1423 01:02:29,200 --> 01:02:26,810 they have a wall clock an OE keyboard 1424 01:02:30,520 --> 01:02:29,210 mouse pad that's a great idea you know 1425 01:02:33,310 --> 01:02:30,530 what we should get a hold of them and 1426 01:02:39,030 --> 01:02:33,320 offer that as a premium for listeners at 1427 01:02:42,070 --> 01:02:39,040 the power cast I'm looking at right now 1428 01:02:44,470 --> 01:02:42,080 the way keyboard is wound up on just 1429 01:02:49,060 --> 01:02:44,480 about any device 1430 01:02:51,609 --> 01:02:49,070 our clothing article toy accessory you 1431 01:02:55,060 --> 01:02:51,619 name it it's one of the most popular 1432 01:02:58,120 --> 01:02:55,070 designs out there and the official Ouija 1433 01:03:00,609 --> 01:02:58,130 board design has appeared on a lot of 1434 01:03:03,670 --> 01:03:00,619 things and an artist's have you know 1435 01:03:06,670 --> 01:03:03,680 come up with their own take on the 1436 01:03:08,530 --> 01:03:06,680 talking board and created a 1437 01:03:14,500 --> 01:03:08,540 limited-edition boards 1438 01:03:16,240 --> 01:03:14,510 differences absolutely and some of these 1439 01:03:18,490 --> 01:03:16,250 get to be highly collectible you know 1440 01:03:23,320 --> 01:03:18,500 they're signed and numbered I have some 1441 01:03:25,599 --> 01:03:23,330 of those myself I'm going to talk about 1442 01:03:27,130 --> 01:03:25,609 this further with this company that 1443 01:03:28,750 --> 01:03:27,140 makes the mousepad I don't know if 1444 01:03:31,450 --> 01:03:28,760 people use mouse pads as much anymore 1445 01:03:33,370 --> 01:03:31,460 because you have all those optical mice 1446 01:03:35,290 --> 01:03:33,380 and all this other stuff and of course 1447 01:03:37,330 --> 01:03:35,300 you can't get one how about a case an 1448 01:03:39,340 --> 01:03:37,340 iPad case it looks like a Ouija board 1449 01:03:41,050 --> 01:03:39,350 will develop one of those we have 1450 01:03:49,390 --> 01:03:41,060 rosemary ellen guiley joining us with 1451 01:03:52,000 --> 01:03:49,400 Jeanne and Chris you're in the Erica ray 1452 01:03:54,490 --> 01:03:52,010 Perkins a reclusive veteran burned out 1453 01:03:56,760 --> 01:03:54,500 from the Gulf War lives tortured by 1454 01:03:59,140 --> 01:03:56,770 relentless perplexing nightmares 1455 01:04:01,240 --> 01:03:59,150 nightmares of a horrific battle in deep 1456 01:04:03,340 --> 01:04:01,250 space and of a mysterious woman's 1457 01:04:06,460 --> 01:04:03,350 suffering and agony for her devastated 1458 01:04:10,470 --> 01:04:06,470 world a woman not yet born calling 1459 01:04:13,090 --> 01:04:10,480 across centuries to him then a 1460 01:04:16,420 --> 01:04:13,100 coincidence leads him to his destiny his 1461 01:04:18,820 --> 01:04:16,430 chance to alter the universe attack of 1462 01:04:20,859 --> 01:04:18,830 the rock was the former fiction editor 1463 01:04:23,170 --> 01:04:20,869 for Star Wars and Indiana Jones Robert 1464 01:04:25,240 --> 01:04:23,180 Simpson writes the soul of the novel 1465 01:04:27,010 --> 01:04:25,250 attack of the Rockets lies in its heart 1466 01:04:29,109 --> 01:04:27,020 and passion for building a convincing 1467 01:04:31,470 --> 01:04:29,119 tale of a love that spans the galaxy a 1468 01:04:34,380 --> 01:04:31,480 thrilling story attack 1469 01:04:36,180 --> 01:04:34,390 raka is available now read a simple 1470 01:04:38,520 --> 01:04:36,190 chapter and get a special discount off 1471 01:04:43,800 --> 01:04:38,530 of the cover price at our website Rocco 1472 01:04:46,890 --> 01:04:43,810 is calm that's our Ock o IDs calm attack 1473 01:04:48,930 --> 01:04:46,900 of the rocket a novel in the grand 1474 01:04:50,609 --> 01:04:48,940 science-fiction tradition we've all 1475 01:04:53,280 --> 01:04:50,619 heard the phrase don't judge a book by 1476 01:04:55,349 --> 01:04:53,290 it's cover hawai saying for sure now 1477 01:04:58,020 --> 01:04:55,359 apply that wisdom to nutrition don't 1478 01:05:00,390 --> 01:04:58,030 judge milk by the animal camel milk the 1479 01:05:02,760 --> 01:05:00,400 best kept health secret ever see for 1480 01:05:04,950 --> 01:05:02,770 yourself at camel milk for sale calm and 1481 01:05:07,140 --> 01:05:04,960 look for the summer camel milk special 1482 01:05:08,960 --> 01:05:07,150 loaded with health benefits far superior 1483 01:05:12,830 --> 01:05:08,970 to other milk camel milk has 1484 01:05:15,780 --> 01:05:12,840 antibacterial antiviral and anti-israel 1485 01:05:18,150 --> 01:05:15,790 moons and is three times higher in 1486 01:05:21,150 --> 01:05:18,160 vitamin C than cow's milk ten times 1487 01:05:22,950 --> 01:05:21,160 higher in iron plus it contains 52 units 1488 01:05:25,380 --> 01:05:22,960 of insulin like proteins per liter 1489 01:05:27,270 --> 01:05:25,390 effectively lowering blood sugar levels 1490 01:05:29,760 --> 01:05:27,280 many of our members testified that 1491 01:05:32,550 --> 01:05:29,770 drinking camel milk reverse diabetes and 1492 01:05:34,770 --> 01:05:32,560 greatly improved autism camel milk comes 1493 01:05:37,050 --> 01:05:34,780 fresh or frozen from your trusted local 1494 01:05:39,450 --> 01:05:37,060 family farm shipped on dry ice to 1495 01:05:42,240 --> 01:05:39,460 preserve freshness go to camel milk for 1496 01:05:44,040 --> 01:05:42,250 sale calm now and look under products 1497 01:05:46,680 --> 01:05:44,050 and pricing for the summer special with 1498 01:05:51,630 --> 01:05:46,690 free bonus points that's camel milk for 1499 01:05:53,700 --> 01:05:51,640 sale calm every day nearly 3,000 1500 01:05:55,380 --> 01:05:53,710 families enter into foreclosure and face 1501 01:05:57,570 --> 01:05:55,390 losing their home if you're currently 1502 01:05:58,920 --> 01:05:57,580 behind on your mortgage you can still 1503 01:06:01,410 --> 01:05:58,930 avoid foreclosure 1504 01:06:03,780 --> 01:06:01,420 you can save your home but you need to 1505 01:06:06,359 --> 01:06:03,790 act now we're allied state foreclosure 1506 01:06:08,280 --> 01:06:06,369 services or experts in saving homes from 1507 01:06:08,520 --> 01:06:08,290 foreclosure 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now and let us help you 1522 01:06:39,810 --> 01:06:37,900 save your home you've worked hard to 1523 01:06:41,460 --> 01:06:39,820 build a life with your family let us 1524 01:06:42,990 --> 01:06:41,470 help you keep your home call now before 1525 01:06:44,640 --> 01:06:43,000 it's too late one eight hundred five 1526 01:06:46,170 --> 01:06:44,650 nine seven eight eight four three 1527 01:06:47,880 --> 01:06:46,180 one eight hundred five nine seven eight 1528 01:06:50,730 --> 01:06:47,890 eight four three one eight hundred five 1529 01:06:53,340 --> 01:06:50,740 nine seven eight eight four three hello 1530 01:06:55,250 --> 01:06:53,350 congratulations what we're losing all 1531 01:06:58,500 --> 01:06:55,260 that weight how do you do it so fast 1532 01:07:00,780 --> 01:06:58,510 ASAP what what's that mean are you ready 1533 01:07:02,850 --> 01:07:00,790 to get as skinny as possible as soon as 1534 01:07:05,070 --> 01:07:02,860 possible as simple as possible and as 1535 01:07:08,220 --> 01:07:05,080 sexy as possible I'm listening get with 1536 01:07:09,810 --> 01:07:08,230 the ASAP program it's real and it works 1537 01:07:12,930 --> 01:07:09,820 no smooth talk knows slick advertising 1538 01:07:16,230 --> 01:07:12,940 and no exaggerated claims of success I 1539 01:07:18,420 --> 01:07:16,240 got it no more welcome to ASAP as slim 1540 01:07:20,850 --> 01:07:18,430 as possible whether you have ten twenty 1541 01:07:23,370 --> 01:07:20,860 or fifty pounds to lose ASAP is your 1542 01:07:25,170 --> 01:07:23,380 weight loss answer ASAP targets the 1543 01:07:26,880 --> 01:07:25,180 abnormal fat reserves and makes them 1544 01:07:29,160 --> 01:07:26,890 available to be burned as fuel and 1545 01:07:31,710 --> 01:07:29,170 contains no caffeine or hormones order 1546 01:07:33,150 --> 01:07:31,720 ASAP at wholesale prices or join the 1547 01:07:36,120 --> 01:07:33,160 team to share the business with others 1548 01:07:38,040 --> 01:07:36,130 visit GC and team.com or call eight 1549 01:07:41,520 --> 01:07:38,050 seven seven eight seven eight four two 1550 01:07:43,650 --> 01:07:41,530 zero three GCM team.com or call eight 1551 01:07:46,050 --> 01:07:43,660 seven seven eight seven eight four two 1552 01:07:51,510 --> 01:07:46,060 zero three lose weight and look great 1553 01:07:53,580 --> 01:07:51,520 with ASAP as slim as possible we'd like 1554 01:07:56,190 --> 01:07:53,590 to hear from you if you have a comment 1555 01:07:59,250 --> 01:07:56,200 or question about the para cast sent it 1556 01:08:02,430 --> 01:07:59,260 to news at the para cast com 1557 01:08:04,680 --> 01:08:02,440 that's news at the para cast dot-com and 1558 01:08:07,860 --> 01:08:04,690 don't forget to visit our famous para 1559 01:08:11,700 --> 01:08:07,870 cast community forums at forum dot the 1560 01:08:14,520 --> 01:08:11,710 para cast common man there is a 1561 01:08:16,620 --> 01:08:14,530 flash-flood outside the Arroyo next to 1562 01:08:17,670 --> 01:08:16,630 the house is raging with about three and 1563 01:08:20,180 --> 01:08:17,680 a half four feet of water 1564 01:08:24,090 --> 01:08:20,190 so basically chris is going to be 1565 01:08:27,270 --> 01:08:24,100 talking and doing this show waist-deep 1566 01:08:29,520 --> 01:08:27,280 in water right I hope not because I'm 1567 01:08:31,020 --> 01:08:29,530 looking out and boy it looks like boy 1568 01:08:32,990 --> 01:08:31,030 you can get a kayak in that and you 1569 01:08:35,400 --> 01:08:33,000 could really whip down this Arroyo who 1570 01:08:37,620 --> 01:08:35,410 tell our listeners like what part of 1571 01:08:39,690 --> 01:08:37,630 Arizona you're in roughly speaking well 1572 01:08:41,490 --> 01:08:39,700 I'm right in West Adan right now and I'm 1573 01:08:43,470 --> 01:08:41,500 towards the bottom of Airport Mesa and 1574 01:08:45,360 --> 01:08:43,480 all this water is funneling down Airport 1575 01:08:47,190 --> 01:08:45,370 Mesa and getting this this Arroyo and 1576 01:08:50,310 --> 01:08:47,200 it's a raging torrent right now and it's 1577 01:08:53,220 --> 01:08:50,320 about 75 feet away from the house 1578 01:08:55,680 --> 01:08:53,230 we have rosemary ellen guiley who is in 1579 01:08:57,870 --> 01:08:55,690 a place where she doesn't have raging 1580 01:08:58,500 --> 01:08:57,880 water but we're talking about raging 1581 01:09:01,200 --> 01:08:58,510 Ouija board 1582 01:09:02,670 --> 01:09:01,210 and just briefly before we ended our 1583 01:09:05,370 --> 01:09:02,680 last segment I was talking about all the 1584 01:09:08,010 --> 01:09:05,380 forms and shapes Ouija boards common I 1585 01:09:09,690 --> 01:09:08,020 mentioned mousepads and I think we might 1586 01:09:12,030 --> 01:09:09,700 consider maybe offering that as a 1587 01:09:14,100 --> 01:09:12,040 premium on the power cast have talked to 1588 01:09:16,200 --> 01:09:14,110 the vendor it would be fun and that's 1589 01:09:18,630 --> 01:09:16,210 the point here for a lot of people it's 1590 01:09:21,030 --> 01:09:18,640 just an entertainment device how many 1591 01:09:22,860 --> 01:09:21,040 people by the way have bought Ouija 1592 01:09:25,410 --> 01:09:22,870 boards over the years every do a survey 1593 01:09:27,800 --> 01:09:25,420 I don't know exactly what the total 1594 01:09:29,610 --> 01:09:27,810 number of boards have been sold but 1595 01:09:32,820 --> 01:09:29,620 considering that it's one of the most 1596 01:09:35,670 --> 01:09:32,830 popular gaming devices out there for 1597 01:09:37,680 --> 01:09:35,680 well over a century now you know we're 1598 01:09:40,020 --> 01:09:37,690 definitely into the millions 1599 01:09:43,020 --> 01:09:40,030 yeah probably millions you're right no 1600 01:09:46,830 --> 01:09:43,030 gosh yes I wish wish I had the one I 1601 01:09:48,420 --> 01:09:46,840 found back in in college 1602 01:09:50,130 --> 01:09:48,430 it didn't have a planchette but it was 1603 01:09:52,680 --> 01:09:50,140 the board but it looked like it was from 1604 01:09:54,510 --> 01:09:52,690 the 20s because it was the would one 1605 01:09:58,290 --> 01:09:54,520 when did they stop making me the actual 1606 01:10:02,100 --> 01:09:58,300 wood version the wood ones went into I 1607 01:10:03,510 --> 01:10:02,110 would say around the end of the 20s yeah 1608 01:10:05,340 --> 01:10:03,520 that's what I figured it was boy I 1609 01:10:07,710 --> 01:10:05,350 should have held on to that maybe the 1610 01:10:11,970 --> 01:10:07,720 early 30s yeah if you still had that it 1611 01:10:14,430 --> 01:10:11,980 might be rather valuable I don't I think 1612 01:10:20,010 --> 01:10:14,440 my roommate ended up with it he's at the 1613 01:10:22,470 --> 01:10:20,020 clean feed no no the spirits didn't like 1614 01:10:24,990 --> 01:10:22,480 that yeah we were we were wild college 1615 01:10:27,030 --> 01:10:25,000 guys you know what could we do well I 1616 01:10:29,370 --> 01:10:27,040 have to think now about the things I 1617 01:10:32,910 --> 01:10:29,380 sold or didn't retain like early 1618 01:10:34,500 --> 01:10:32,920 spider-man comic books wow they'd be 1619 01:10:36,330 --> 01:10:34,510 worth a lot of money I didn't have one 1620 01:10:38,580 --> 01:10:36,340 of the early action comics or Batman's 1621 01:10:41,400 --> 01:10:38,590 though I'd one of the original frisbees 1622 01:10:43,620 --> 01:10:41,410 it's worth a fortune now I also had a 1623 01:10:46,260 --> 01:10:43,630 Pluto platter which is also worth a lot 1624 01:10:48,960 --> 01:10:46,270 of money which was the second frisbee 1625 01:10:50,670 --> 01:10:48,970 I was a real frisbee fan how about you 1626 01:10:53,190 --> 01:10:50,680 what other collectable things you have 1627 01:10:54,540 --> 01:10:53,200 that come from the occult I'm sure 1628 01:10:56,910 --> 01:10:54,550 you've got quite a collection of cards 1629 01:10:59,550 --> 01:10:56,920 rosemary what is your favorite to row 1630 01:11:02,040 --> 01:10:59,560 deck well my favorite tarot deck is so 1631 01:11:06,000 --> 01:11:02,050 when I co-created with the artist Bob 1632 01:11:08,490 --> 01:11:06,010 place it's the alchemical a row and that 1633 01:11:11,859 --> 01:11:08,500 came out in the mid 1990s we've just put 1634 01:11:14,020 --> 01:11:11,869 out the third edition on that 1635 01:11:16,359 --> 01:11:14,030 and because we're doing it ourselves now 1636 01:11:18,729 --> 01:11:16,369 we got our rights back and so we're in 1637 01:11:21,220 --> 01:11:18,739 total control I want to ask you very 1638 01:11:23,589 --> 01:11:21,230 briefly you call it to row but most 1639 01:11:25,899 --> 01:11:23,599 people call it Tarot it's pronounced 1640 01:11:27,100 --> 01:11:25,909 both ways I usually say taro but some 1641 01:11:29,589 --> 01:11:27,110 people say taro 1642 01:11:32,950 --> 01:11:29,599 it's like Ouija some people say we just 1643 01:11:34,720 --> 01:11:32,960 and most people say Ouija I was just 1644 01:11:37,030 --> 01:11:34,730 saying I mean I didn't have people 1645 01:11:41,229 --> 01:11:37,040 coming up to me and say you have a Ouija 1646 01:11:43,000 --> 01:11:41,239 board or a Ouija board and actually you 1647 01:11:46,570 --> 01:11:43,010 know now that you bring it up nobody 1648 01:11:50,020 --> 01:11:46,580 really knows the exact origin of the 1649 01:11:53,350 --> 01:11:50,030 name come from wouldn't and what does it 1650 01:11:56,399 --> 01:11:53,360 have a meaning and nobody really knows 1651 01:11:59,649 --> 01:11:56,409 exactly how the name was conceived or 1652 01:12:03,850 --> 01:11:59,659 what exactly it means they're just 1653 01:12:06,609 --> 01:12:03,860 stories told and in one story one of the 1654 01:12:09,370 --> 01:12:06,619 original patent holders Charles Kennard 1655 01:12:13,000 --> 01:12:09,380 who was the first one to to manufacture 1656 01:12:15,040 --> 01:12:13,010 the board he said that or the story goes 1657 01:12:17,200 --> 01:12:15,050 but he said that a spirit gave him the 1658 01:12:19,839 --> 01:12:17,210 name and sent it meant good luck and 1659 01:12:23,260 --> 01:12:19,849 another story says well it means yes in 1660 01:12:25,240 --> 01:12:23,270 French and German we and yah in which 1661 01:12:27,070 --> 01:12:25,250 case it would be pants no we are board 1662 01:12:29,859 --> 01:12:27,080 which doesn't seem to make much sense 1663 01:12:30,939 --> 01:12:29,869 but that was one of the stories to I'm 1664 01:12:34,780 --> 01:12:30,949 going by myself 1665 01:12:36,580 --> 01:12:34,790 we aboard a we aboard William Fuld who 1666 01:12:39,040 --> 01:12:36,590 was the man who really put the Ouija 1667 01:12:41,020 --> 01:12:39,050 board on the map he consolidated the 1668 01:12:43,720 --> 01:12:41,030 power and the company and got the patent 1669 01:12:45,550 --> 01:12:43,730 and he wanted a lot of mystique around 1670 01:12:49,180 --> 01:12:45,560 the board because that's what's sold 1671 01:12:52,990 --> 01:12:49,190 mystery fun entertainment and so he 1672 01:12:54,820 --> 01:12:53,000 encouraged an aura of mystery and 1673 01:12:57,399 --> 01:12:54,830 uncertainty about the board and its 1674 01:12:59,770 --> 01:12:57,409 origins okay so he was a marketing guy 1675 01:13:01,959 --> 01:12:59,780 he was he didn't start out as a 1676 01:13:04,089 --> 01:13:01,969 marketing guy he actually worked his way 1677 01:13:06,250 --> 01:13:04,099 up in the company he was a varnish ER 1678 01:13:10,060 --> 01:13:06,260 and a painter but he was very ambitious 1679 01:13:12,490 --> 01:13:10,070 and very shrewd and made himself to be 1680 01:13:15,100 --> 01:13:12,500 very indispensable in the company and so 1681 01:13:17,050 --> 01:13:15,110 when the principal's kind of wanted to 1682 01:13:19,060 --> 01:13:17,060 get out of the business or cash in on 1683 01:13:23,200 --> 01:13:19,070 their investments he was more than happy 1684 01:13:24,790 --> 01:13:23,210 to step in and take over and the he and 1685 01:13:27,790 --> 01:13:24,800 his brother Isaac 1686 01:13:29,649 --> 01:13:27,800 started out in a partnership and and had 1687 01:13:31,839 --> 01:13:29,659 a feud and split up and his brother 1688 01:13:33,970 --> 01:13:31,849 Isaac even started a competing company 1689 01:13:36,549 --> 01:13:33,980 for a while until his brother shut him 1690 01:13:38,830 --> 01:13:36,559 down legally William Fuld went on to 1691 01:13:42,910 --> 01:13:38,840 really put the board on the map and that 1692 01:13:46,600 --> 01:13:42,920 was the 1920s by 1927 he was dead he was 1693 01:13:50,020 --> 01:13:46,610 only in his mid-50s he was trying to 1694 01:13:52,030 --> 01:13:50,030 repair a flagpole on the roof of one of 1695 01:13:56,890 --> 01:13:52,040 his manufacturing plants in Baltimore 1696 01:13:59,290 --> 01:13:56,900 fell and died of his injuries he only 1697 01:14:00,729 --> 01:13:59,300 had like some minor injuries and and a 1698 01:14:03,760 --> 01:14:00,739 broken rib but on the way to the 1699 01:14:05,620 --> 01:14:03,770 hospital his rib pierced his heart and 1700 01:14:07,839 --> 01:14:05,630 that's what killed him 1701 01:14:11,080 --> 01:14:07,849 how about famous spiritualist from the 1702 01:14:14,379 --> 01:14:11,090 time like the Fox sisters or some of the 1703 01:14:15,549 --> 01:14:14,389 people that were friendly with Sir 1704 01:14:18,010 --> 01:14:15,559 Arthur Conan Doyle 1705 01:14:22,689 --> 01:14:18,020 or how about Houdini I seem to recall a 1706 01:14:25,720 --> 01:14:22,699 couple of debunking efforts that he made 1707 01:14:27,700 --> 01:14:25,730 trying to dispel the the popularity of 1708 01:14:31,180 --> 01:14:27,710 the board has been a truly a viable 1709 01:14:33,310 --> 01:14:31,190 device do we have any indication that 1710 01:14:34,750 --> 01:14:33,320 some of the you know the the movers and 1711 01:14:37,270 --> 01:14:34,760 shakers within the spiritualist movement 1712 01:14:38,890 --> 01:14:37,280 at the end of the 19th century and into 1713 01:14:40,990 --> 01:14:38,900 the beginning of the 20th century did 1714 01:14:44,200 --> 01:14:41,000 they ever utilize this I don't have any 1715 01:14:47,140 --> 01:14:44,210 real good stories involving those 1716 01:14:48,669 --> 01:14:47,150 personalities and actually those 1717 01:14:49,810 --> 01:14:48,679 individuals would have considered 1718 01:14:52,260 --> 01:14:49,820 something like the Ouija board 1719 01:14:55,000 --> 01:14:52,270 competition because most of the 1720 01:14:58,030 --> 01:14:55,010 prominent mediums of the spiritualist 1721 01:15:01,930 --> 01:14:58,040 days and that really started to peter 1722 01:15:05,169 --> 01:15:01,940 out by about the 1930s they they were 1723 01:15:07,660 --> 01:15:05,179 the star they were getting messages 1724 01:15:09,700 --> 01:15:07,670 either mentally or through trance 1725 01:15:12,549 --> 01:15:09,710 mediumship through the manipulation of 1726 01:15:14,470 --> 01:15:12,559 the voice to speak to the spirit so they 1727 01:15:16,510 --> 01:15:14,480 were not relying on something like this 1728 01:15:19,060 --> 01:15:16,520 this is a consider that device for the 1729 01:15:22,240 --> 01:15:19,070 common person who didn't have a you know 1730 01:15:24,419 --> 01:15:22,250 the right touch yeah it's like your 1731 01:15:27,850 --> 01:15:24,429 basic entry level divination 1732 01:15:31,030 --> 01:15:27,860 spiritualist tool basically now that the 1733 01:15:33,069 --> 01:15:31,040 rocker sisters oh go ahead no no go 1734 01:15:35,950 --> 01:15:33,079 ahead no I was just going to comment 1735 01:15:38,200 --> 01:15:35,960 yeah about the Fox sisters I mean in a 1736 01:15:41,500 --> 01:15:38,210 way they sort of used a crude 1737 01:15:43,870 --> 01:15:41,510 form of a Ouija methodology when they 1738 01:15:44,590 --> 01:15:43,880 started with the the rapping spirit in 1739 01:15:46,720 --> 01:15:44,600 their home 1740 01:15:49,270 --> 01:15:46,730 you know claiming their you know they 1741 01:15:51,370 --> 01:15:49,280 could they could get messages and in the 1742 01:15:54,640 --> 01:15:51,380 beginning they were spelling out 1743 01:15:57,820 --> 01:15:54,650 messages letter by letter by getting the 1744 01:16:00,190 --> 01:15:57,830 spirit to rap once and twice you know 1745 01:16:02,470 --> 01:16:00,200 for yes and know whether or not a letter 1746 01:16:04,680 --> 01:16:02,480 was accurate so it's a very crude and 1747 01:16:06,580 --> 01:16:04,690 slow form of letter by letter 1748 01:16:08,950 --> 01:16:06,590 communication that the Ouija board 1749 01:16:11,470 --> 01:16:08,960 really streamlined of course I guess the 1750 01:16:13,420 --> 01:16:11,480 real skeptics here would say well if the 1751 01:16:15,130 --> 01:16:13,430 spirit world is so powerful why can't 1752 01:16:17,500 --> 01:16:15,140 they just talk why do they have to use 1753 01:16:19,690 --> 01:16:17,510 these crazy implements and that's a 1754 01:16:21,970 --> 01:16:19,700 question that rosemary ellen guiley will 1755 01:16:24,459 --> 01:16:21,980 deal with as we get to our next segment 1756 01:16:26,500 --> 01:16:24,469 the book is Ouija gone wild and the 1757 01:16:31,050 --> 01:16:26,510 weather's gone wild near Sedona Arizona 1758 01:16:31,060 --> 01:16:38,780 [Music] 1759 01:16:44,399 --> 01:16:41,000 America's number one source for 1760 01:16:49,530 --> 01:16:44,409 independent talk radio for over a decade 1761 01:16:51,959 --> 01:16:49,540 we are the gcn radio network graphic 1762 01:16:54,419 --> 01:16:51,969 converter is the image manipulation tool 1763 01:16:56,850 --> 01:16:54,429 for the rest of us it does not use any 1764 01:16:59,310 --> 01:16:56,860 database you get full control of all 1765 01:17:01,649 --> 01:16:59,320 your files want to view the images of a 1766 01:17:04,620 --> 01:17:01,659 folder drag it into graphic converter 1767 01:17:06,540 --> 01:17:04,630 and a powerful browser opens up to show 1768 01:17:09,030 --> 01:17:06,550 your image files you could use it for 1769 01:17:11,220 --> 01:17:09,040 slideshows you could use it to import 1770 01:17:13,620 --> 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coming apart 1798 01:18:24,090 --> 01:18:23,530 world you need something to keep it tied 1799 01:18:26,340 --> 01:18:24,100 together 1800 01:18:28,530 --> 01:18:26,350 that's something is atwood rope the 1801 01:18:30,800 --> 01:18:28,540 highest quality rope made in USA from 1802 01:18:33,780 --> 01:18:30,810 exotic braids for military rescue 1803 01:18:36,090 --> 01:18:33,790 arborists shipyards towline or boating 1804 01:18:38,160 --> 01:18:36,100 quality rope and affordable prices you 1805 01:18:41,129 --> 01:18:38,170 and your customers can depend on find a 1806 01:18:43,800 --> 01:18:41,139 dealer or shop online at atwood rope net 1807 01:18:45,810 --> 01:18:43,810 and to promo code radio to receive 100 1808 01:18:46,880 --> 01:18:45,820 feet of 550 paracord free with purchase 1809 01:18:48,740 --> 01:18:46,890 at 1810 01:18:51,080 --> 01:18:48,750 wrote working to keep the world tied 1811 01:18:52,280 --> 01:18:51,090 together we all know there are secrets 1812 01:18:53,960 --> 01:18:52,290 behind closed doors in every 1813 01:18:55,970 --> 01:18:53,970 relationship and one of the biggest is 1814 01:18:57,770 --> 01:18:55,980 that men are losing libido or sexual 1815 01:18:59,780 --> 01:18:57,780 desire especially if you're a man over 1816 01:19:00,980 --> 01:18:59,790 40 the problem could be declining 1817 01:19:02,840 --> 01:19:00,990 testosterone levels 1818 01:19:04,730 --> 01:19:02,850 remember it's testosterone that makes a 1819 01:19:07,040 --> 01:19:04,740 man a man in every way that's why we 1820 01:19:09,080 --> 01:19:07,050 created t Gen T Gen is an all-natural 1821 01:19:10,730 --> 01:19:09,090 formula with ingredients proven to boost 1822 01:19:12,290 --> 01:19:10,740 your own testosterone optimum 1823 01:19:14,390 --> 01:19:12,300 testosterone levels mean better mood 1824 01:19:16,850 --> 01:19:14,400 energy and of course better sex life 1825 01:19:18,740 --> 01:19:16,860 here's Gina from California my husband 1826 01:19:20,690 --> 01:19:18,750 tried one month of teaching and we both 1827 01:19:22,640 --> 01:19:20,700 noticed his desire increased right away 1828 01:19:24,560 --> 01:19:22,650 he felt the difference in his energy 1829 01:19:26,750 --> 01:19:24,570 level I certainly liked the other 1830 01:19:28,970 --> 01:19:26,760 effects that had on him great product 1831 01:19:31,310 --> 01:19:28,980 and now for the first time you can try 1832 01:19:32,570 --> 01:19:31,320 TJ and absolutely free for 30 days just 1833 01:19:35,920 --> 01:19:32,580 pay shipping today and see the 1834 01:19:39,170 --> 01:19:35,930 incredible results for yourself call 882 1835 01:19:41,360 --> 01:19:39,180 594 one eight hundred eight two two five 1836 01:19:43,340 --> 01:19:41,370 nine four one T Jen works or you simply 1837 01:19:45,950 --> 01:19:43,350 don't pay for your 30 day free trial 1838 01:19:48,170 --> 01:19:45,960 call 808 two two five nine four one 1839 01:19:50,930 --> 01:19:48,180 eight hundred eight two two five nine 1840 01:19:53,030 --> 01:19:50,940 four one don't throw away leftovers 1841 01:19:54,740 --> 01:19:53,040 instead from all your leftovers 1842 01:19:56,540 --> 01:19:54,750 vegetable peels egg shells coffee 1843 01:19:58,280 --> 01:19:56,550 grounds pizza crusts and more into the 1844 01:19:59,900 --> 01:19:58,290 Bokashi if you love to garden and 1845 01:20:01,970 --> 01:19:59,910 compost but don't like the hassle of 1846 01:20:03,650 --> 01:20:01,980 turning a compost bin or this smell then 1847 01:20:05,330 --> 01:20:03,660 check out the e/m Bokashi food waste 1848 01:20:07,640 --> 01:20:05,340 recycling system from terra organics 1849 01:20:09,110 --> 01:20:07,650 finally a way to recycle all your food 1850 01:20:11,660 --> 01:20:09,120 and plant waste safely and effectively 1851 01:20:13,520 --> 01:20:11,670 and stop using fertilizers the e/m 1852 01:20:15,350 --> 01:20:13,530 Bokashi food waste recycling system 1853 01:20:17,240 --> 01:20:15,360 rather than decomposition the Bokashi 1854 01:20:19,100 --> 01:20:17,250 system uses fermentation to break down 1855 01:20:20,990 --> 01:20:19,110 waste so it takes less time to create 1856 01:20:23,150 --> 01:20:21,000 nutrient dense huma's for crops or 1857 01:20:25,040 --> 01:20:23,160 gardens with no turning and no obnoxious 1858 01:20:27,620 --> 01:20:25,050 odors to learn more and order your 1859 01:20:29,030 --> 01:20:27,630 Bokashi online visit Tarragona comm and 1860 01:20:33,800 --> 01:20:29,040 click on the orange button that's 1861 01:20:35,930 --> 01:20:33,810 Tarragona comm spelled ter a gan IX comm 1862 01:20:38,300 --> 01:20:35,940 or call eight six six three six nine 1863 01:20:40,670 --> 01:20:38,310 three six seven eight that's eight six 1864 01:20:42,560 --> 01:20:40,680 six three six nine three six seven eight 1865 01:20:44,180 --> 01:20:42,570 recycle all your food wastes in about 1866 01:20:46,310 --> 01:20:44,190 six weeks with the Bokashi food waste 1867 01:20:51,210 --> 01:20:46,320 recycling system from Tarragona comm 1868 01:20:56,700 --> 01:20:53,850 there's Jim Mosely editor or a sausage 1869 01:20:59,220 --> 01:20:56,710 smear and I'm here to say a good word or 1870 01:21:02,040 --> 01:20:59,230 two about the para cast which I believe 1871 01:21:10,410 --> 01:21:02,050 is the gold standard of paranormal radio 1872 01:21:12,690 --> 01:21:10,420 listen to it if you can not the sound of 1873 01:21:14,160 --> 01:21:12,700 lightning striking all about Ouija 1874 01:21:15,930 --> 01:21:14,170 boards Ouija gone wild 1875 01:21:18,600 --> 01:21:15,940 written by rosemary ellen guiley and 1876 01:21:20,340 --> 01:21:18,610 rick fisher so I guess the question I 1877 01:21:22,020 --> 01:21:20,350 asked which is not meant to be sarcastic 1878 01:21:24,870 --> 01:21:22,030 it's meant to be a real question that 1879 01:21:27,870 --> 01:21:24,880 skeptics might ask which is all right if 1880 01:21:30,930 --> 01:21:27,880 the spiritual world is so powerful why 1881 01:21:33,570 --> 01:21:30,940 use this kind of device why can't they 1882 01:21:36,060 --> 01:21:33,580 just convey it more simply I wish there 1883 01:21:38,960 --> 01:21:36,070 was a good answer for that gene and I 1884 01:21:41,430 --> 01:21:38,970 think if we could get more direct 1885 01:21:44,900 --> 01:21:41,440 communications more easily we wouldn't 1886 01:21:47,880 --> 01:21:44,910 and we human beings would not have to 1887 01:21:49,860 --> 01:21:47,890 invent all of these other devices as we 1888 01:21:51,840 --> 01:21:49,870 have throughout history from the 1889 01:21:55,050 --> 01:21:51,850 beginning we've wanted to penetrate 1890 01:21:58,230 --> 01:21:55,060 these these barriers between the spirit 1891 01:22:00,420 --> 01:21:58,240 world and the living and the dead and it 1892 01:22:03,360 --> 01:22:00,430 doesn't seem to be readily possible we 1893 01:22:05,670 --> 01:22:03,370 keep looking for ways to do it and we 1894 01:22:07,500 --> 01:22:05,680 don't get direct communication very 1895 01:22:09,600 --> 01:22:07,510 easily it only seems to come through 1896 01:22:11,850 --> 01:22:09,610 certain individuals with a certain 1897 01:22:15,270 --> 01:22:11,860 attunement at certain times in certain 1898 01:22:20,010 --> 01:22:15,280 places and we keep looking for ways to 1899 01:22:20,600 --> 01:22:20,020 make it more reliable and the the Ouija 1900 01:22:23,760 --> 01:22:20,610 board 1901 01:22:26,220 --> 01:22:23,770 combine that with entertainment that was 1902 01:22:28,680 --> 01:22:26,230 the the genius behind the board is that 1903 01:22:31,260 --> 01:22:28,690 you had something that could be a 1904 01:22:32,760 --> 01:22:31,270 serious communication device but it was 1905 01:22:36,120 --> 01:22:32,770 something that you could bring into the 1906 01:22:37,890 --> 01:22:36,130 family environment and be a non wonder 1907 01:22:39,900 --> 01:22:37,900 over come on kids 1908 01:22:43,440 --> 01:22:39,910 tonight's Ouija board night get your mom 1909 01:22:45,600 --> 01:22:43,450 and let's have fun in 1920 I think was 1910 01:22:49,380 --> 01:22:45,610 1920 years sometime in the early 20s 1911 01:22:52,400 --> 01:22:49,390 Norman Rockwell put a cover on Saturday 1912 01:22:54,510 --> 01:22:52,410 Post magazine of a young man and woman 1913 01:22:56,220 --> 01:22:54,520 and there they look like they're a 1914 01:22:57,780 --> 01:22:56,230 courting couple you know that there's 1915 01:22:59,310 --> 01:22:57,790 romance going on between them and 1916 01:23:01,080 --> 01:22:59,320 they're working a Ouija board and 1917 01:23:02,880 --> 01:23:01,090 they've got it on their knees are 1918 01:23:04,450 --> 01:23:02,890 touching they're facing each other their 1919 01:23:08,080 --> 01:23:04,460 knees are touching they've got the ball 1920 01:23:10,300 --> 01:23:08,090 on their knees and she's looking off 1921 01:23:11,800 --> 01:23:10,310 into space like she wants to know you 1922 01:23:13,479 --> 01:23:11,810 know will he won't he and how are we 1923 01:23:17,020 --> 01:23:13,489 going to get married and he's looking at 1924 01:23:20,080 --> 01:23:17,030 her and you get this impression of 1925 01:23:23,020 --> 01:23:20,090 something that's a very wholesome sort 1926 01:23:26,709 --> 01:23:23,030 of of activity or entertainment very 1927 01:23:29,680 --> 01:23:26,719 different from the skewed picture that 1928 01:23:31,990 --> 01:23:29,690 the media painted the board today so 1929 01:23:35,080 --> 01:23:32,000 basically at that point it was a source 1930 01:23:36,520 --> 01:23:35,090 of fun and frolic or whatever a way for 1931 01:23:38,170 --> 01:23:36,530 two people to get more closer together 1932 01:23:41,470 --> 01:23:38,180 you know knees touching and everything 1933 01:23:44,320 --> 01:23:41,480 and now demons will attack you if you 1934 01:23:47,320 --> 01:23:44,330 unleash them it's really a shame how the 1935 01:23:50,200 --> 01:23:47,330 board yeah it's a shame how the board 1936 01:23:53,110 --> 01:23:50,210 has become demonized and yes people have 1937 01:23:55,090 --> 01:23:53,120 had bad experiences but people have bad 1938 01:23:57,570 --> 01:23:55,100 experiences and all kinds of spirit 1939 01:24:00,520 --> 01:23:57,580 communications Hollywood has 1940 01:24:05,350 --> 01:24:00,530 consistently used this debord as a 1941 01:24:07,750 --> 01:24:05,360 device to propel horror plots you know 1942 01:24:09,760 --> 01:24:07,760 you can burn it you can have plant chefs 1943 01:24:11,620 --> 01:24:09,770 fly across the room you can have evil 1944 01:24:15,459 --> 01:24:11,630 messages spelled out it's very 1945 01:24:19,090 --> 01:24:15,469 convenient and the movies The Exorcist 1946 01:24:22,959 --> 01:24:19,100 and and which board really I think did 1947 01:24:25,120 --> 01:24:22,969 the most to sway pop culture opinion 1948 01:24:27,310 --> 01:24:25,130 that the board itself was somehow 1949 01:24:29,950 --> 01:24:27,320 demonic and evil which is definitely not 1950 01:24:32,770 --> 01:24:29,960 the case yeah just just a piece of 1951 01:24:34,990 --> 01:24:32,780 cardboard let's get let's get real you 1952 01:24:38,200 --> 01:24:35,000 know we can put all sorts of intent and 1953 01:24:40,300 --> 01:24:38,210 and focus and psychic energy into 1954 01:24:42,880 --> 01:24:40,310 anything and have it have it become the 1955 01:24:44,080 --> 01:24:42,890 focus of all sorts of positive and 1956 01:24:46,000 --> 01:24:44,090 negative things but that doesn't 1957 01:24:50,170 --> 01:24:46,010 necessarily mean that the object itself 1958 01:24:53,140 --> 01:24:50,180 is the cause or or the you know the the 1959 01:24:54,700 --> 01:24:53,150 actual motivational force to have things 1960 01:24:56,709 --> 01:24:54,710 happen either positive or negative 1961 01:24:59,830 --> 01:24:56,719 that's it's all the intent that goes 1962 01:25:03,520 --> 01:24:59,840 into it that is the important thing I've 1963 01:25:06,940 --> 01:25:03,530 been hearing for many years that certain 1964 01:25:10,780 --> 01:25:06,950 people who may be psychically fragile 1965 01:25:13,390 --> 01:25:10,790 vulnerable prone to to negativity 1966 01:25:15,220 --> 01:25:13,400 whether it's emotional or acting out 1967 01:25:17,050 --> 01:25:15,230 negative things that they they should 1968 01:25:18,969 --> 01:25:17,060 stay away from a Ouija board because it 1969 01:25:21,520 --> 01:25:18,979 tends to magnify 1970 01:25:25,029 --> 01:25:21,530 tweek eNOS in particular individuals 1971 01:25:27,089 --> 01:25:25,039 some of the stories in your book kind of 1972 01:25:29,560 --> 01:25:27,099 indicate that there may be some 1973 01:25:32,410 --> 01:25:29,570 relevance to that do you want to address 1974 01:25:35,080 --> 01:25:32,420 that I agree with you wholeheartedly on 1975 01:25:38,529 --> 01:25:35,090 that Chris and that's my opinion too 1976 01:25:40,330 --> 01:25:38,539 that there are individuals who and they 1977 01:25:42,160 --> 01:25:40,340 seem to be drawn to the paranormal and 1978 01:25:45,040 --> 01:25:42,170 occult like you know Maz to the 1979 01:25:49,029 --> 01:25:45,050 proverbial flame that any sort of 1980 01:25:50,410 --> 01:25:49,039 paranormal activity derails them or you 1981 01:25:52,029 --> 01:25:50,420 know it's very psychologically 1982 01:25:54,580 --> 01:25:52,039 distressing they they want the 1983 01:25:57,759 --> 01:25:54,590 experience but then they can't handle 1984 01:25:59,350 --> 01:25:57,769 the experience and with something like 1985 01:26:02,109 --> 01:25:59,360 the Ouija board being so readily 1986 01:26:04,120 --> 01:26:02,119 available and brought out often as an 1987 01:26:07,330 --> 01:26:04,130 entertainment device these are some of 1988 01:26:09,279 --> 01:26:07,340 the people then who get engaged in these 1989 01:26:12,279 --> 01:26:09,289 activities and then they start having 1990 01:26:14,410 --> 01:26:12,289 problems I have used a Ouija board on 1991 01:26:18,580 --> 01:26:14,420 investigations I don't consider it a 1992 01:26:22,479 --> 01:26:18,590 very productive investigation tool but 1993 01:26:24,609 --> 01:26:22,489 I've experimented a lot of oh well are 1994 01:26:26,469 --> 01:26:24,619 you know or any of them reliable because 1995 01:26:29,500 --> 01:26:26,479 you can't really prove who you're 1996 01:26:32,049 --> 01:26:29,510 communicating with and in most cases but 1997 01:26:34,479 --> 01:26:32,059 yet I consider you know I experiment 1998 01:26:36,939 --> 01:26:34,489 with all sorts of devices but yet I 1999 01:26:40,299 --> 01:26:36,949 recommend to people not to take these 2000 01:26:44,310 --> 01:26:40,309 things on investigations because the 2001 01:26:47,680 --> 01:26:44,320 individuals involved in these sessions 2002 01:26:50,439 --> 01:26:47,690 are really more of the problem than the 2003 01:26:51,729 --> 01:26:50,449 device itself it's their reactions if 2004 01:26:53,859 --> 01:26:51,739 some of them are bringing these 2005 01:26:55,629 --> 01:26:53,869 subconscious fears about the Ouija board 2006 01:26:59,199 --> 01:26:55,639 they've been told that it's problematic 2007 01:27:03,850 --> 01:26:59,209 or bad anything that comes across the 2008 01:27:06,100 --> 01:27:03,860 board is going to have a certain kind of 2009 01:27:10,000 --> 01:27:06,110 effect on them a self-fulfilling 2010 01:27:11,500 --> 01:27:10,010 prophecies and in many cases yes so if 2011 01:27:13,419 --> 01:27:11,510 you believe the Ouija board to be a 2012 01:27:16,180 --> 01:27:13,429 source of evil or to bring forth evil 2013 01:27:17,410 --> 01:27:16,190 entities then maybe that's what you'll 2014 01:27:20,129 --> 01:27:17,420 be in touch with well if you believe 2015 01:27:24,160 --> 01:27:20,139 it's fun it's rewarding it's uplifting 2016 01:27:26,350 --> 01:27:24,170 you'll contact beings that are more in 2017 01:27:29,469 --> 01:27:26,360 that fashion well you're certainly more 2018 01:27:32,560 --> 01:27:29,479 likely to have a neutral experience or 2019 01:27:36,000 --> 01:27:32,570 one that even if a problematic community 2020 01:27:39,040 --> 01:27:36,010 came through it wouldn't upset you and 2021 01:27:41,230 --> 01:27:39,050 send you into a tailspin of nightmares 2022 01:27:43,750 --> 01:27:41,240 and sensations of being watched and 2023 01:27:45,910 --> 01:27:43,760 things like that now let's look at that 2024 01:27:47,620 --> 01:27:45,920 particular part of it which is the 2025 01:27:50,140 --> 01:27:47,630 negative part where people have been 2026 01:27:53,050 --> 01:27:50,150 affected psychologically do we have 2027 01:27:55,780 --> 01:27:53,060 people who really gone on to have to be 2028 01:27:57,760 --> 01:27:55,790 treated or committed as a result we can 2029 01:27:59,590 --> 01:27:57,770 speculate that yes there are people 2030 01:28:03,940 --> 01:27:59,600 who've had to have some sort of 2031 01:28:06,160 --> 01:28:03,950 counseling as a result now I will say in 2032 01:28:09,100 --> 01:28:06,170 the defense of people who have had 2033 01:28:11,260 --> 01:28:09,110 negative experiences as I mentioned some 2034 01:28:13,150 --> 01:28:11,270 of these stories came from people that I 2035 01:28:15,580 --> 01:28:13,160 considered to be very well grounded in 2036 01:28:17,380 --> 01:28:15,590 the paranormal and very experienced in 2037 01:28:20,110 --> 01:28:17,390 investigations and they still had 2038 01:28:23,680 --> 01:28:20,120 experiences that caught them off guard 2039 01:28:25,330 --> 01:28:23,690 now there none of these situations are 2040 01:28:28,030 --> 01:28:25,340 black-and-white they're complex they 2041 01:28:33,460 --> 01:28:28,040 involve a lot of psychological dynamics 2042 01:28:37,630 --> 01:28:33,470 too but in the chapter devoted to Zozo 2043 01:28:41,530 --> 01:28:37,640 now Zozo seems to be an entity who is 2044 01:28:43,210 --> 01:28:41,540 very very nasty and prefers Ouija board 2045 01:28:50,550 --> 01:28:43,220 communications or talking board 2046 01:28:58,750 --> 01:28:53,650 distressing experiences that people have 2047 01:29:00,820 --> 01:28:58,760 had with Zozo personalities there's 2048 01:29:05,260 --> 01:29:00,830 those O's also seems to use a lot of 2049 01:29:08,290 --> 01:29:05,270 names we tell the story of Darren Evans 2050 01:29:10,720 --> 01:29:08,300 who is a person who really put Zozo on 2051 01:29:12,850 --> 01:29:10,730 the map in terms of collecting 2052 01:29:15,550 --> 01:29:12,860 information about Zozo and stories and 2053 01:29:17,710 --> 01:29:15,560 documenting the pattern and Darren says 2054 01:29:20,650 --> 01:29:17,720 by his own admission that you know he 2055 01:29:24,130 --> 01:29:20,660 became very preoccupied with the Ouija 2056 01:29:26,920 --> 01:29:24,140 board and was in touch with this entity 2057 01:29:29,560 --> 01:29:26,930 name is Osso which then dominated his 2058 01:29:31,960 --> 01:29:29,570 life off the board it had a 2059 01:29:34,510 --> 01:29:31,970 psychological influence on him he felt 2060 01:29:37,980 --> 01:29:34,520 that it interfered in his family life 2061 01:29:40,390 --> 01:29:37,990 his relationship his marriage it 2062 01:29:42,610 --> 01:29:40,400 deteriorated his mental state he 2063 01:29:44,710 --> 01:29:42,620 couldn't hold a job very well and he 2064 01:29:46,029 --> 01:29:44,720 said he went into a complete nervous 2065 01:29:48,099 --> 01:29:46,039 breakdown at 2066 01:29:51,759 --> 01:29:48,109 one point and it took him years to get 2067 01:29:55,629 --> 01:29:51,769 clear of it so do we have any examples 2068 01:29:58,389 --> 01:29:55,639 of a particular entity claiming to come 2069 01:30:00,279 --> 01:29:58,399 through and having totally separate 2070 01:30:03,459 --> 01:30:00,289 appearances of an entity totally 2071 01:30:04,569 --> 01:30:03,469 unrelated to other cases I'm not sure I 2072 01:30:07,659 --> 01:30:04,579 understand the question 2073 01:30:10,809 --> 01:30:07,669 well like did somebody else in in some 2074 01:30:16,689 --> 01:30:10,819 unrelated fashion who had no knowledge 2075 01:30:18,639 --> 01:30:16,699 if those Ozone did oh yes in fact we 2076 01:30:20,770 --> 01:30:18,649 have some in the book as well 2077 01:30:22,750 --> 01:30:20,780 and we'll get into what's in the book a 2078 01:30:24,639 --> 01:30:22,760 couple of those descriptions as we 2079 01:30:27,609 --> 01:30:24,649 continue with rosemary ellen guiley it's 2080 01:30:30,780 --> 01:30:27,619 about Ouija boards with Jeanne and Chris 2081 01:30:37,660 --> 01:30:30,790 you're in the paragraph 2082 01:30:43,760 --> 01:30:41,060 are you tired of searching for a great 2083 01:30:47,750 --> 01:30:43,770 talk radio company more important search 2084 01:30:50,420 --> 01:30:47,760 tree overall we are the gcn radio 2085 01:30:53,150 --> 01:30:50,430 network whether it's personal mail 2086 01:30:56,030 --> 01:30:53,160 whether it's business email you want 2087 01:30:58,580 --> 01:30:56,040 reliable dependable delivery freedom 2088 01:31:00,740 --> 01:30:58,590 from spam 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01:35:06,939 --> 01:35:00,910 listening to the para cast 2187 01:35:11,260 --> 01:35:09,130 Regina and Kristen the power cast the 2188 01:35:13,630 --> 01:35:11,270 Ouija boards take front and center the 2189 01:35:15,760 --> 01:35:13,640 book is called Ouija gone wild written 2190 01:35:17,560 --> 01:35:15,770 with Rick Fischer shocking true stories 2191 01:35:20,740 --> 01:35:17,570 you say you're about to tell us a story 2192 01:35:23,770 --> 01:35:20,750 and maybe you can continue that now it 2193 01:35:27,160 --> 01:35:23,780 concerns the entity known most widely as 2194 01:35:29,530 --> 01:35:27,170 Zozo zoz oh and a negative entity who 2195 01:35:31,030 --> 01:35:29,540 comes with the Ouija board and starts 2196 01:35:32,979 --> 01:35:31,040 out as mr. nice guy 2197 01:35:37,000 --> 01:35:32,989 sometimes masquerading as a dead person 2198 01:35:39,430 --> 01:35:37,010 that the the board users know and then 2199 01:35:41,050 --> 01:35:39,440 getting increasingly nasty and seeming 2200 01:35:43,169 --> 01:35:41,060 to have the ability to reach out beyond 2201 01:35:47,340 --> 01:35:43,179 the board and affect people's health 2202 01:35:51,250 --> 01:35:47,350 mental state luck relationships 2203 01:35:54,100 --> 01:35:51,260 Zozo a name of it or just a label that's 2204 01:35:57,490 --> 01:35:54,110 applied this is the name that the anta t 2205 01:36:02,200 --> 01:35:57,500 gives Zozo and yeah someone's saying I'm 2206 01:36:05,020 --> 01:36:02,210 Zozo run the other way absolutely and we 2207 01:36:07,750 --> 01:36:05,030 have to it's actually the name of a 2208 01:36:11,260 --> 01:36:07,760 demon a very minor demon that is listed 2209 01:36:12,850 --> 01:36:11,270 in the 19th century infernal dictionary 2210 01:36:14,790 --> 01:36:12,860 that Colin des Plantes he put together 2211 01:36:18,310 --> 01:36:14,800 that's one of the most famous 2212 01:36:21,700 --> 01:36:18,320 dictionaries of demons a minor demon 2213 01:36:25,240 --> 01:36:21,710 from a possession case now Zozo seems to 2214 01:36:28,300 --> 01:36:25,250 have alter egos as well like Zaza Z one 2215 01:36:30,340 --> 01:36:28,310 a lot of other Z names but I had a case 2216 01:36:32,169 --> 01:36:30,350 involving a friend of mine just a few 2217 01:36:36,220 --> 01:36:32,179 months ago who was using a Ouija board 2218 01:36:38,650 --> 01:36:36,230 with another person and an entity came 2219 01:36:42,550 --> 01:36:38,660 through who started out you know being 2220 01:36:44,530 --> 01:36:42,560 rather friendly asking you know are you 2221 01:36:47,380 --> 01:36:44,540 Zozo I'm looking for Zozo and then 2222 01:36:50,709 --> 01:36:47,390 finally admitting that I am Zozo well 2223 01:36:53,140 --> 01:36:50,719 you know and getting very kind of darker 2224 01:36:54,939 --> 01:36:53,150 and tone and she she asked me she said 2225 01:36:56,890 --> 01:36:54,949 have you ever heard of an entity she'd 2226 01:36:59,620 --> 01:36:56,900 never heard of Zozo before she said have 2227 01:37:01,900 --> 01:36:59,630 you ever heard of an Ana D named Zozo I 2228 01:37:05,260 --> 01:37:01,910 said oh those those quite famous in 2229 01:37:07,689 --> 01:37:05,270 board communications and when she 2230 01:37:10,260 --> 01:37:07,699 I sent her around to a few sources and 2231 01:37:12,520 --> 01:37:10,270 she was absolutely astonished that 2232 01:37:15,400 --> 01:37:12,530 without knowing a thing about this 2233 01:37:17,709 --> 01:37:15,410 entity it had come through on her board 2234 01:37:20,630 --> 01:37:17,719 communications so Zozo exists 2235 01:37:23,330 --> 01:37:20,640 independently of one's expectations its 2236 01:37:25,700 --> 01:37:23,340 seems to be and from an occult 2237 01:37:28,970 --> 01:37:25,710 perspective the scenario would be that 2238 01:37:31,940 --> 01:37:28,980 there is an entity out there who wishes 2239 01:37:34,400 --> 01:37:31,950 to wreak havoc with people who goes by 2240 01:37:37,120 --> 01:37:34,410 the name of Zozo and looks for 2241 01:37:40,760 --> 01:37:37,130 opportunities to do so primarily through 2242 01:37:43,880 --> 01:37:40,770 talking board communications is some 2243 01:37:46,010 --> 01:37:43,890 sort of tricks or typing it's definitely 2244 01:37:48,470 --> 01:37:46,020 trickster because it starts out as mr. 2245 01:37:50,780 --> 01:37:48,480 nice guy and sometimes masquerades as a 2246 01:37:53,750 --> 01:37:50,790 dead person and then at some point 2247 01:37:56,420 --> 01:37:53,760 reveals itself well I'm not your your 2248 01:37:59,990 --> 01:37:56,430 grandfather I'm you know my name is Zozo 2249 01:38:02,210 --> 01:38:00,000 so at that point if you are doing this 2250 01:38:03,950 --> 01:38:02,220 you're working on the Ouija board or 2251 01:38:07,040 --> 01:38:03,960 whatever doing any kind of communication 2252 01:38:10,130 --> 01:38:07,050 and you get the name Zozo what do you do 2253 01:38:12,350 --> 01:38:10,140 stop say begone what do you do my 2254 01:38:14,540 --> 01:38:12,360 general advice is to indicate this 2255 01:38:15,350 --> 01:38:14,550 session and tell the entity to go away 2256 01:38:18,680 --> 01:38:15,360 and not come back 2257 01:38:20,780 --> 01:38:18,690 and if it comes back again if you do 2258 01:38:24,070 --> 01:38:20,790 another board session to stay away from 2259 01:38:27,200 --> 01:38:24,080 the talking board for a period of time 2260 01:38:32,270 --> 01:38:27,210 now I've had this entity come through as 2261 01:38:34,760 --> 01:38:32,280 Zaza and that's been oh about half a 2262 01:38:37,790 --> 01:38:34,770 dozen times now in the past couple of 2263 01:38:43,420 --> 01:38:37,800 years where I don't get Zozo but it goes 2264 01:38:49,150 --> 01:38:43,430 by the name Zaza and maybe when I wore 2265 01:38:51,620 --> 01:38:49,160 yeah miss spelled phonetically spelled a 2266 01:38:53,720 --> 01:38:51,630 bunch of hip-hoppers and you know you 2267 01:39:00,080 --> 01:38:53,730 know a Ouija board session indicate they 2268 01:39:03,670 --> 01:39:00,090 get the entity yo-yo crashing bomb or 2269 01:39:07,280 --> 01:39:03,680 something like that or a drum roll or a 2270 01:39:10,460 --> 01:39:07,290 symbol but I won't they say I tell bad 2271 01:39:13,610 --> 01:39:10,470 jokes you just have to have a sense of 2272 01:39:16,070 --> 01:39:13,620 humor sometimes about these things to 2273 01:39:18,080 --> 01:39:16,080 keep them in the right perspective okay 2274 01:39:20,450 --> 01:39:18,090 but Zaza it's the same thing stop the 2275 01:39:22,780 --> 01:39:20,460 sessions walk away from the board don't 2276 01:39:25,940 --> 01:39:22,790 do it for a few months give it a rest 2277 01:39:28,160 --> 01:39:25,950 and with some people it may have to be 2278 01:39:30,290 --> 01:39:28,170 this is not the device for you because 2279 01:39:33,060 --> 01:39:30,300 it's going to be problematically you 2280 01:39:36,420 --> 01:39:33,070 know whenever you use it is there 2281 01:39:39,170 --> 01:39:36,430 maybe certain people attract that kind 2282 01:39:41,670 --> 01:39:39,180 of entity or being there are people who 2283 01:39:44,880 --> 01:39:41,680 as I mentioned you know earlier in the 2284 01:39:47,070 --> 01:39:44,890 show there are people who have a higher 2285 01:39:48,600 --> 01:39:47,080 degree of natural mediumistic ability 2286 01:39:50,010 --> 01:39:48,610 and a lot of people don't even know it 2287 01:39:52,260 --> 01:39:50,020 because they've never tried it before 2288 01:39:53,610 --> 01:39:52,270 maybe sitting down at a Ouija board is 2289 01:39:56,430 --> 01:39:53,620 the first time they attempt to 2290 01:39:58,950 --> 01:39:56,440 communicate with spirit and so they 2291 01:40:01,560 --> 01:39:58,960 think it's the board and not them when 2292 01:40:05,310 --> 01:40:01,570 actually it's their own attunement well 2293 01:40:07,320 --> 01:40:05,320 if you're not schooled and trained and 2294 01:40:09,900 --> 01:40:07,330 know what you're doing in spirit 2295 01:40:11,960 --> 01:40:09,910 communications and you open up like that 2296 01:40:15,090 --> 01:40:11,970 all kinds of things might answer 2297 01:40:17,250 --> 01:40:15,100 including opportunistic entities who 2298 01:40:19,050 --> 01:40:17,260 want to Apple which way around with you 2299 01:40:20,820 --> 01:40:19,060 you know one thing that might be 2300 01:40:22,830 --> 01:40:20,830 interesting here because listeners are 2301 01:40:24,300 --> 01:40:22,840 hearing this and many have never 2302 01:40:27,630 --> 01:40:24,310 experimented with a Ouija board before 2303 01:40:31,050 --> 01:40:27,640 maybe they want to go and buy one okay 2304 01:40:32,610 --> 01:40:31,060 so maybe this segment may be part of the 2305 01:40:34,560 --> 01:40:32,620 next and we also have questions a few 2306 01:40:36,870 --> 01:40:34,570 questions from our listeners tell our 2307 01:40:38,610 --> 01:40:36,880 listeners getting a Ouija board for the 2308 01:40:40,980 --> 01:40:38,620 first time maybe give them a Ouija board 2309 01:40:44,310 --> 01:40:40,990 101 what they should do what they should 2310 01:40:46,140 --> 01:40:44,320 look out for how best to produce some 2311 01:40:47,850 --> 01:40:46,150 kind of impact or effect my 2312 01:40:50,730 --> 01:40:47,860 recommendation is to start with a new 2313 01:40:55,110 --> 01:40:50,740 board and that's because sometimes with 2314 01:40:58,320 --> 01:40:55,120 old boards there they can there is the 2315 01:41:01,770 --> 01:40:58,330 potential for spirit attachment this 2316 01:41:03,810 --> 01:41:01,780 it's not necessarily the case I have old 2317 01:41:07,710 --> 01:41:03,820 boards in my collection but start with a 2318 01:41:10,950 --> 01:41:07,720 new one start fresh and being good 2319 01:41:13,110 --> 01:41:10,960 energy be focused on what you're doing 2320 01:41:15,300 --> 01:41:13,120 it's not entertainment don't sit down 2321 01:41:17,010 --> 01:41:15,310 and have a lark and want to provoke 2322 01:41:18,840 --> 01:41:17,020 something and see what kind of a scare 2323 01:41:22,020 --> 01:41:18,850 you get it treat it like a serious 2324 01:41:26,250 --> 01:41:22,030 communication device with a specific 2325 01:41:29,520 --> 01:41:26,260 goal in mind and direct the session you 2326 01:41:32,730 --> 01:41:29,530 can visualize yourself in a protective 2327 01:41:36,030 --> 01:41:32,740 space if you have meditations or prayers 2328 01:41:38,490 --> 01:41:36,040 or invocations of protective spirits to 2329 01:41:41,580 --> 01:41:38,500 do before a session that's very helpful 2330 01:41:45,870 --> 01:41:41,590 for your own peace of mind if if nothing 2331 01:41:46,710 --> 01:41:45,880 else and direct the session here's my 2332 01:41:48,870 --> 01:41:46,720 purpose for 2333 01:41:53,310 --> 01:41:48,880 Munich ating I want to connect with 2334 01:41:56,220 --> 01:41:53,320 so-and-so and these are my questions and 2335 01:41:59,040 --> 01:41:56,230 if communications start getting kind of 2336 01:42:02,250 --> 01:41:59,050 freaky you don't like the answers or 2337 01:42:05,640 --> 01:42:02,260 there seems to be an ugly personality 2338 01:42:09,720 --> 01:42:05,650 you muscles in just in the session in 2339 01:42:13,200 --> 01:42:09,730 the session tell all the participants 2340 01:42:15,390 --> 01:42:13,210 the door is closed the spirits stay in 2341 01:42:18,420 --> 01:42:15,400 the spirit world and the door to the 2342 01:42:21,360 --> 01:42:18,430 physical world is shut and then it's 2343 01:42:25,890 --> 01:42:21,370 very important also to shut down your 2344 01:42:28,920 --> 01:42:25,900 own self to detach from the session and 2345 01:42:31,230 --> 01:42:28,930 not think about it a lot not play it 2346 01:42:32,760 --> 01:42:31,240 over and over again in your head this is 2347 01:42:36,270 --> 01:42:32,770 where a lot of people start to build up 2348 01:42:38,670 --> 01:42:36,280 anxiety and that keeps the link open to 2349 01:42:40,980 --> 01:42:38,680 something that wants to play around so 2350 01:42:42,810 --> 01:42:40,990 if I follow those recommendations I'll 2351 01:42:43,200 --> 01:42:42,820 have a friendly experience with a Ouija 2352 01:42:44,840 --> 01:42:43,210 board 2353 01:42:50,270 --> 01:42:44,850 well you certainly increase your odds 2354 01:42:56,490 --> 01:42:50,280 gene of having a neutral I don't know 2355 01:42:58,470 --> 01:42:56,500 Neverland variant jobs Steve Jobs I 2356 01:43:00,510 --> 01:42:58,480 don't know I don't think so 2357 01:43:02,910 --> 01:43:00,520 I do not think so I've never had 2358 01:43:05,760 --> 01:43:02,920 anything with a Ouija board that struck 2359 01:43:07,950 --> 01:43:05,770 me as being strange now my first wife 2360 01:43:11,130 --> 01:43:07,960 and I played with it that's Geneva Hagen 2361 01:43:13,980 --> 01:43:11,140 that's her name now and we had 2362 01:43:17,490 --> 01:43:13,990 situations where it moved around in a 2363 01:43:18,780 --> 01:43:17,500 way that she felt was unusual and she 2364 01:43:20,910 --> 01:43:18,790 had a couple of friends where things 2365 01:43:23,310 --> 01:43:20,920 might have happened again we looked at 2366 01:43:26,820 --> 01:43:23,320 it with skepticism didn't quite believe 2367 01:43:29,100 --> 01:43:26,830 it now why even then and this gets into 2368 01:43:31,140 --> 01:43:29,110 the paranormal realm and the UFO world 2369 01:43:33,120 --> 01:43:31,150 and everything why assume it's the 2370 01:43:35,520 --> 01:43:33,130 spiritual world and maybe not somebody 2371 01:43:37,890 --> 01:43:35,530 in an alternate dimension talking with 2372 01:43:40,980 --> 01:43:37,900 us that's actually a potential 2373 01:43:43,320 --> 01:43:40,990 explanation for some of this and I do 2374 01:43:45,060 --> 01:43:43,330 believe that some of our spirit 2375 01:43:47,430 --> 01:43:45,070 communications where we think we're 2376 01:43:50,880 --> 01:43:47,440 talking to the dead or to two spirits 2377 01:43:53,820 --> 01:43:50,890 we're talking to personalities who like 2378 01:43:56,490 --> 01:43:53,830 us are living in their own dimensional 2379 01:43:59,070 --> 01:43:56,500 space and they may be communicating with 2380 01:43:59,540 --> 01:43:59,080 us thinking we're spirits as well so 2381 01:44:01,299 --> 01:43:59,550 there you 2382 01:44:04,430 --> 01:44:01,309 their weed rewards in their reality 2383 01:44:07,120 --> 01:44:04,440 thinking it's fun and games and they get 2384 01:44:09,970 --> 01:44:07,130 in touch with someone and they is us 2385 01:44:14,000 --> 01:44:09,980 it's certainly plausible under the 2386 01:44:16,129 --> 01:44:14,010 multi-dimensional model for reality that 2387 01:44:19,479 --> 01:44:16,139 we have dimensions that are layered on 2388 01:44:21,680 --> 01:44:19,489 top of ours and I've often thought in my 2389 01:44:24,859 --> 01:44:21,690 experiments with the the Franks Box 2390 01:44:27,680 --> 01:44:24,869 technology that I've often wondered you 2391 01:44:31,459 --> 01:44:27,690 know am I talking to other beings or 2392 01:44:34,189 --> 01:44:31,469 people or versions of humans in other 2393 01:44:36,439 --> 01:44:34,199 dimensions rather to disembodied 2394 01:44:38,540 --> 01:44:36,449 entities in in the afterlife or the 2395 01:44:41,510 --> 01:44:38,550 spirit realm and this is something that 2396 01:44:44,419 --> 01:44:41,520 that we have no way of really proving at 2397 01:44:47,180 --> 01:44:44,429 this point we have no way of proving the 2398 01:44:49,160 --> 01:44:47,190 identities of the beings that we 2399 01:44:52,609 --> 01:44:49,170 communicate with even when they give us 2400 01:44:54,640 --> 01:44:52,619 information that can be validated 2401 01:44:59,060 --> 01:44:54,650 through records or through somebody's 2402 01:45:01,310 --> 01:44:59,070 knowledge because in in occultism it's 2403 01:45:03,319 --> 01:45:01,320 it's held by many people that the 2404 01:45:06,500 --> 01:45:03,329 communicating spirits some of them at 2405 01:45:09,439 --> 01:45:06,510 least have a great ability to masquerade 2406 01:45:11,330 --> 01:45:09,449 and that they can assume personas the 2407 01:45:14,060 --> 01:45:11,340 way a human being would put on a glove 2408 01:45:15,979 --> 01:45:14,070 they can slip on a personality and know 2409 01:45:18,350 --> 01:45:15,989 enough about it to convince you that 2410 01:45:20,120 --> 01:45:18,360 they are somebody else this is not 2411 01:45:22,850 --> 01:45:20,130 somebody else this is rosemary ellen 2412 01:45:27,070 --> 01:45:22,860 guiley with gene and chris you're in the 2413 01:45:31,580 --> 01:45:28,580 [Music] 2414 01:45:34,790 --> 01:45:31,590 the GZ and Radio Network providing the 2415 01:45:39,770 --> 01:45:34,800 world with hard-hitting talk radio G C 2416 01:45:41,240 --> 01:45:39,780 and great talk radio starts here hi Ted 2417 01:45:43,460 --> 01:45:41,250 Anderson announcing a great way to 2418 01:45:45,650 --> 01:45:43,470 listen to radio on the telephone by 2419 01:45:47,720 --> 01:45:45,660 calling seven six oh five six nine 2420 01:45:50,300 --> 01:45:47,730 seventy seven hundred you'll be hearing 2421 01:45:52,760 --> 01:45:50,310 juicy and live.com programs in seconds 2422 01:45:55,130 --> 01:45:52,770 come to GC and live.com find your 2423 01:45:58,040 --> 01:45:55,140 favorite host dedicated phone number and 2424 01:46:00,560 --> 01:45:58,050 hear them 24/7 you heard me right every 2425 01:46:03,080 --> 01:46:00,570 show has a dedicated phone number stop 2426 01:46:05,480 --> 01:46:03,090 by GC and live.com and bookmark their 2427 01:46:07,870 --> 01:46:05,490 number today and again that's seven six 2428 01:46:10,490 --> 01:46:07,880 oh five six nine seventy seven hundred 2429 01:46:12,590 --> 01:46:10,500 we the people grow cotton weave fabric 2430 01:46:14,210 --> 01:46:12,600 engraving can bed strips and fibers to 2431 01:46:15,950 --> 01:46:14,220 protect from counterfeit and carding to 2432 01:46:16,490 --> 01:46:15,960 a private bank having a light back at 2433 01:46:18,200 --> 01:46:16,500 interest 2434 01:46:20,060 --> 01:46:18,210 forcing taxes to service debt this 2435 01:46:21,500 --> 01:46:20,070 capitalism was Jefferson correct when 2436 01:46:23,150 --> 01:46:21,510 stating a central bank issuing the 2437 01:46:24,260 --> 01:46:23,160 public currency is a greater menace to 2438 01:46:25,640 --> 01:46:24,270 the liberties of the people than a 2439 01:46:27,080 --> 01:46:25,650 standing army today understand I'm 2440 01:46:28,910 --> 01:46:27,090 placing a free silver dollar in a book 2441 01:46:32,360 --> 01:46:28,920 that explains our monetary system call 2442 01:46:35,540 --> 01:46:32,370 for your copy 800 686 to 237 it's time 2443 01:46:41,240 --> 01:46:35,550 to understand the system call 866 to 237 2444 01:46:45,050 --> 01:46:41,250 that's 800 686 to 237 the summer 2445 01:46:47,480 --> 01:46:45,060 specials are on and HHA herbal healer 2446 01:46:49,610 --> 01:46:47,490 Academy current customers know this is 2447 01:46:51,680 --> 01:46:49,620 the time to save bake at Urban healer 2448 01:46:53,780 --> 01:46:51,690 calm and you customers 2449 01:46:56,420 --> 01:46:53,790 welcome to the web's best place to save 2450 01:46:58,460 --> 01:46:56,430 on vitamins minerals and more right now 2451 01:47:00,260 --> 01:46:58,470 herbal healers summer specials includes 2452 01:47:03,470 --> 01:47:00,270 our 500 parts per million colloidal 2453 01:47:05,780 --> 01:47:03,480 silver all sizes on sale liquid Cal mag 2454 01:47:08,630 --> 01:47:05,790 vitamin D and organic iodine Co Q 10 2455 01:47:10,820 --> 01:47:08,640 with Hawthorne : enhancers super to 2456 01:47:13,670 --> 01:47:10,830 natural laxatives our exceptional 2457 01:47:14,750 --> 01:47:13,680 product on except memory power and super 2458 01:47:17,150 --> 01:47:14,760 male and PEM Plex 2459 01:47:20,150 --> 01:47:17,160 all on sale for summer at herbal healer 2460 01:47:21,800 --> 01:47:20,160 calm also get 10% off on the herbal 2461 01:47:24,260 --> 01:47:21,810 healer Academy survival course 2462 01:47:26,510 --> 01:47:24,270 information that might save your life 2463 01:47:29,180 --> 01:47:26,520 enjoy same-day shipping and free online 2464 01:47:31,950 --> 01:47:29,190 newsletter log on to our nation's leader 2465 01:47:35,070 --> 01:47:31,960 in supplying quality natural medicine 2466 01:47:38,130 --> 01:47:35,080 education since 1988 herbal healer 2467 01:47:46,089 --> 01:47:38,140 Academy at herbal healer calm 2468 01:47:54,129 --> 01:47:49,819 welcome back to the para cast the gold 2469 01:48:01,669 --> 01:47:54,139 standard of paranormal radio and now 2470 01:48:03,469 --> 01:48:01,679 here's Jean Steinberg notice that Chris 2471 01:48:06,619 --> 01:48:03,479 is calming down now because I guess the 2472 01:48:11,059 --> 01:48:06,629 weather situation extreme severe weather 2473 01:48:12,559 --> 01:48:11,069 is now less severe yeah that's part of 2474 01:48:14,689 --> 01:48:12,569 it it's actually getting brighter out 2475 01:48:18,679 --> 01:48:14,699 and the Arroyo is not in danger of 2476 01:48:21,379 --> 01:48:18,689 overflowing its banks no I think we're 2477 01:48:23,089 --> 01:48:21,389 over the hump and past the excitement 2478 01:48:25,729 --> 01:48:23,099 you know it was such and go for a while 2479 01:48:27,589 --> 01:48:25,739 it was I mean I had to cover the 2480 01:48:29,719 --> 01:48:27,599 mouthpiece on the phone because the hill 2481 01:48:32,179 --> 01:48:29,729 was so loud we have rosemary ellen 2482 01:48:34,729 --> 01:48:32,189 guiley who with Rick Fisher wrote the 2483 01:48:38,089 --> 01:48:34,739 book Ouija gone wild shocking true 2484 01:48:40,549 --> 01:48:38,099 stories rosemary tell us who Rick Fisher 2485 01:48:42,589 --> 01:48:40,559 is how did he become connected with you 2486 01:48:44,949 --> 01:48:42,599 in this book rick has a longtime friend 2487 01:48:48,589 --> 01:48:44,959 of mine he's the founder of the 2488 01:48:50,719 --> 01:48:48,599 Pennsylvania Paranormal Society and a 2489 01:48:53,389 --> 01:48:50,729 very good paranormal investigator and 2490 01:48:54,949 --> 01:48:53,399 EVP researcher I've known Rick for many 2491 01:48:56,839 --> 01:48:54,959 years so we have to bring him on the 2492 01:48:59,509 --> 01:48:56,849 show that's what you're telling us he's 2493 01:49:02,149 --> 01:48:59,519 a very knowledgeable guy I get together 2494 01:49:04,219 --> 01:49:02,159 with paranormal friends and do REE 2495 01:49:06,559 --> 01:49:04,229 retreats and holidays every now and then 2496 01:49:09,319 --> 01:49:06,569 we like to rent haunted homes and great 2497 01:49:11,329 --> 01:49:09,329 locations for research and one year we a 2498 01:49:14,419 --> 01:49:11,339 bunch of us took a house in Gettysburg 2499 01:49:17,269 --> 01:49:14,429 over the battlefield anniversary and we 2500 01:49:18,649 --> 01:49:17,279 were doing some investigations and Rick 2501 01:49:20,719 --> 01:49:18,659 and I start talking about the Ouija 2502 01:49:23,269 --> 01:49:20,729 board and he had been collecting a lot 2503 01:49:25,819 --> 01:49:23,279 of stories mostly from the early days of 2504 01:49:28,579 --> 01:49:25,829 the Ouija board and that's where the 2505 01:49:30,729 --> 01:49:28,589 idea for this book was born I've done 2506 01:49:33,049 --> 01:49:30,739 many investigations with Rick in 2507 01:49:36,199 --> 01:49:33,059 Pennsylvania through the years and he 2508 01:49:38,329 --> 01:49:36,209 has a collection of about 40 to 50 Ouija 2509 01:49:40,639 --> 01:49:38,339 boards himself and has run some more 2510 01:49:42,609 --> 01:49:40,649 formal experiments which we talk about 2511 01:49:45,319 --> 01:49:42,619 in the book as well trying to document 2512 01:49:47,539 --> 01:49:45,329 if there are certain conditions or 2513 01:49:50,419 --> 01:49:47,549 things that can be predicted about board 2514 01:49:52,969 --> 01:49:50,429 use well very very little can be 2515 01:49:55,609 --> 01:49:52,979 predicted I think about this type of 2516 01:49:59,210 --> 01:49:55,619 spirit communication so much depends on 2517 01:50:01,220 --> 01:49:59,220 the individuals using the board 2518 01:50:03,740 --> 01:50:01,230 and consciousness is the real wildcard 2519 01:50:05,300 --> 01:50:03,750 involved a very quick question here that 2520 01:50:05,690 --> 01:50:05,310 all the stories that you report in the 2521 01:50:07,730 --> 01:50:05,700 book 2522 01:50:09,950 --> 01:50:07,740 how'd you validate them did they come 2523 01:50:13,520 --> 01:50:09,960 from newspaper clippings other books one 2524 01:50:16,100 --> 01:50:13,530 the early accounts we took many from 2525 01:50:18,890 --> 01:50:16,110 newspaper clippings we have multiple 2526 01:50:21,800 --> 01:50:18,900 copies of many of the stories and single 2527 01:50:24,260 --> 01:50:21,810 copies of some of them news news reports 2528 01:50:26,840 --> 01:50:24,270 that were written up and some of them 2529 01:50:29,900 --> 01:50:26,850 were also there was also additional 2530 01:50:33,110 --> 01:50:29,910 information available and various 2531 01:50:36,020 --> 01:50:33,120 websites and I did not rely on other 2532 01:50:39,410 --> 01:50:36,030 books about the Ouija board there aren't 2533 01:50:41,360 --> 01:50:39,420 very many of them written and the ones 2534 01:50:43,520 --> 01:50:41,370 that are in print tend to be very 2535 01:50:47,630 --> 01:50:43,530 negative about the Ouija board I did not 2536 01:50:49,700 --> 01:50:47,640 want to be influenced by them I did find 2537 01:50:52,910 --> 01:50:49,710 the book Aleister Crowley in the Ouija 2538 01:50:55,910 --> 01:50:52,920 board interesting from the occult 2539 01:51:00,440 --> 01:50:55,920 perspective the principles of how the 2540 01:51:05,480 --> 01:51:00,450 Ouija board could possibly work and then 2541 01:51:08,960 --> 01:51:05,490 I interviewed a lot of people and talked 2542 01:51:10,580 --> 01:51:08,970 to them about their stories and that's 2543 01:51:12,470 --> 01:51:10,590 how this book came together so there are 2544 01:51:15,440 --> 01:51:12,480 a lot of stories in the book that are 2545 01:51:18,710 --> 01:51:15,450 told for the first time and then we have 2546 01:51:21,650 --> 01:51:18,720 some that are famous like you know the 2547 01:51:24,770 --> 01:51:21,660 the soldiers who went AWOL and some of 2548 01:51:27,500 --> 01:51:24,780 the murder cases and many lesser known 2549 01:51:31,700 --> 01:51:27,510 stories from earlier years as well Bob 2550 01:51:35,420 --> 01:51:31,710 birch who is arguably one of the leading 2551 01:51:37,490 --> 01:51:35,430 experts on William falled the the 2552 01:51:40,480 --> 01:51:37,500 history of the Ouija board and the Ouija 2553 01:51:44,990 --> 01:51:40,490 board itself was a tremendous help to us 2554 01:51:47,360 --> 01:51:45,000 Bob made his collection available to us 2555 01:51:50,390 --> 01:51:47,370 and I've spent quite a bit of time with 2556 01:51:55,700 --> 01:51:50,400 Bob on talking about the Ouija board and 2557 01:51:58,190 --> 01:51:55,710 film in music and books the history of 2558 01:52:01,040 --> 01:51:58,200 the Ouija board the way the board 2559 01:52:04,040 --> 01:52:01,050 evolved so we had some good sources an 2560 01:52:06,830 --> 01:52:04,050 input for this now we didn't have much 2561 01:52:08,300 --> 01:52:06,840 time before we announced this but we did 2562 01:52:11,300 --> 01:52:08,310 get a few questions from our listeners 2563 01:52:12,170 --> 01:52:11,310 so normally as we've told our listeners 2564 01:52:14,660 --> 01:52:12,180 we 2565 01:52:16,640 --> 01:52:14,670 you have a place in our forms at forum 2566 01:52:19,190 --> 01:52:16,650 dr. Peric ascom called the question Bank 2567 01:52:20,840 --> 01:52:19,200 the question Bank is a place where you 2568 01:52:23,030 --> 01:52:20,850 listeners can ask your questions and 2569 01:52:26,750 --> 01:52:23,040 we're working on other methods of doing 2570 01:52:28,430 --> 01:52:26,760 this possibly an accompanying audio file 2571 01:52:30,500 --> 01:52:28,440 so we'll play the audio file and then 2572 01:52:33,380 --> 01:52:30,510 let the listener hear themselves which 2573 01:52:35,630 --> 01:52:33,390 is cool and the guests will hear the 2574 01:52:38,990 --> 01:52:35,640 questioner and maybe get a sense of 2575 01:52:43,490 --> 01:52:39,000 where they are so rosemary are you ready 2576 01:52:46,550 --> 01:52:43,500 just a few questions and ready okay we 2577 01:52:48,860 --> 01:52:46,560 have one from a paranormal adept that's 2578 01:52:52,100 --> 01:52:48,870 the title to give these people called 2579 01:52:55,610 --> 01:52:52,110 nameless has been members since February 2580 01:52:57,710 --> 01:52:55,620 of 2011 really active member to 2581 01:53:00,050 --> 01:52:57,720 questions he says just a cheeky two 2582 01:53:02,840 --> 01:53:00,060 questions I just wanted to know if 2583 01:53:04,940 --> 01:53:02,850 rosemary had ever experienced a Ouija 2584 01:53:07,600 --> 01:53:04,950 board reading that went far beyond just 2585 01:53:12,440 --> 01:53:07,610 the collective consciousness style 2586 01:53:16,610 --> 01:53:12,450 imaginings of the board users personally 2587 01:53:19,880 --> 01:53:16,620 I have not in the chapter are called the 2588 01:53:24,290 --> 01:53:19,890 artistic we Jeff we talked about some of 2589 01:53:26,120 --> 01:53:24,300 the cases where people channeled 2590 01:53:27,920 --> 01:53:26,130 something that got to be quite profound 2591 01:53:32,050 --> 01:53:27,930 and it started with a Ouija board like 2592 01:53:36,650 --> 01:53:32,060 the set material Jane Roberts began 2593 01:53:40,600 --> 01:53:36,660 getting her Seth material first it was 2594 01:53:43,490 --> 01:53:40,610 through kind of a blinding inspiration 2595 01:53:45,340 --> 01:53:43,500 where her she started shifting your 2596 01:53:48,140 --> 01:53:45,350 consciousness and then in the beginning 2597 01:53:51,550 --> 01:53:48,150 working with a Ouija board and then from 2598 01:53:56,090 --> 01:53:51,560 there she went to pretty much ended into 2599 01:54:01,250 --> 01:53:56,100 direct you know mediumship patience 2600 01:54:06,620 --> 01:54:01,260 worth pearl Curran who channelled all 2601 01:54:09,110 --> 01:54:06,630 that work did it painstakingly through 2602 01:54:11,750 --> 01:54:09,120 the Ouija board to literary works that 2603 01:54:15,340 --> 01:54:11,760 came letter by letter with the Ouija 2604 01:54:17,360 --> 01:54:15,350 board but that was early 20 laurie and 2605 01:54:21,230 --> 01:54:17,370 then there were the messages from 2606 01:54:23,710 --> 01:54:21,240 Michael the entity kind of a group 2607 01:54:25,790 --> 01:54:23,720 entity who called itself Michael 2608 01:54:32,210 --> 01:54:25,800 transmitted across a we gypped 2609 01:54:34,100 --> 01:54:32,220 or but even the Seth material as I think 2610 01:54:37,520 --> 01:54:34,110 the Seth material is some of the highest 2611 01:54:40,070 --> 01:54:37,530 quality channel material produced and 2612 01:54:42,050 --> 01:54:40,080 yet even so it doesn't have any concept 2613 01:54:44,000 --> 01:54:42,060 in it they can't be grasped by human 2614 01:54:45,920 --> 01:54:44,010 beings but I think the question also 2615 01:54:49,370 --> 01:54:45,930 needs to be asked is if it was something 2616 01:54:51,530 --> 01:54:49,380 beyond what we could comprehend either 2617 01:54:53,630 --> 01:54:51,540 from the collective or even individually 2618 01:54:56,600 --> 01:54:53,640 how could we even get the information 2619 01:55:01,490 --> 01:54:56,610 because we I don't think we could get 2620 01:55:05,120 --> 01:55:01,500 our our minds around it alright part 2 2621 01:55:07,100 --> 01:55:05,130 from nameless Tarot seems to have its 2622 01:55:09,890 --> 01:55:07,110 roots sprung from the Kabbalistic tree 2623 01:55:12,440 --> 01:55:09,900 as we too have a similar occult pedigree 2624 01:55:14,750 --> 01:55:12,450 or was it just purely a simple 2625 01:55:21,530 --> 01:55:14,760 standalone interface or peripheral 2626 01:55:25,820 --> 01:55:21,540 device well the most direct ancestor of 2627 01:55:29,680 --> 01:55:25,830 the Ouija board was the pointer called 2628 01:55:32,030 --> 01:55:29,690 the planchette which was used in 2629 01:55:36,830 --> 01:55:32,040 spiritualist communications and that was 2630 01:55:39,890 --> 01:55:36,840 a little platform with three legs on it 2631 01:55:43,730 --> 01:55:39,900 a tripod kind of thing and one of the 2632 01:55:45,410 --> 01:55:43,740 legs was a pencil and the medium placed 2633 01:55:49,090 --> 01:55:45,420 their hands on the planchette and then 2634 01:55:52,160 --> 01:55:49,100 the messages wrote out and the pencil so 2635 01:55:55,610 --> 01:55:52,170 that's probably the closest to the 2636 01:55:57,230 --> 01:55:55,620 direct pedigree of the Ouija board but 2637 01:56:00,470 --> 01:55:57,240 there'd been other devices throughout 2638 01:56:02,990 --> 01:56:00,480 history where like rotating wheels have 2639 01:56:05,450 --> 01:56:03,000 been used I mean it was even said in in 2640 01:56:09,280 --> 01:56:05,460 ancient times Pythagoras had some device 2641 01:56:11,990 --> 01:56:09,290 like that where something was 2642 01:56:16,160 --> 01:56:12,000 manipulated by the spirits to spell 2643 01:56:20,960 --> 01:56:16,170 things out and that goes way way back in 2644 01:56:23,360 --> 01:56:20,970 time the tarot cards well there is the 2645 01:56:25,010 --> 01:56:23,370 Kabbalistic influence on those but that 2646 01:56:27,290 --> 01:56:25,020 seems to be much later in the Tarot 2647 01:56:29,660 --> 01:56:27,300 history you know some of the early I 2648 01:56:32,570 --> 01:56:29,670 think the earliest tarot decks come from 2649 01:56:34,970 --> 01:56:32,580 about 1300s and their roots seemed to be 2650 01:56:38,450 --> 01:56:34,980 more organized toward mnemonic learning 2651 01:56:39,490 --> 01:56:38,460 than Kabbalistic occult learning which 2652 01:56:41,890 --> 01:56:39,500 was 2653 01:56:44,530 --> 01:56:41,900 added really added and amplified much 2654 01:56:47,440 --> 01:56:44,540 later in the taro history just very 2655 01:56:49,090 --> 01:56:47,450 briefly a stupid question do tarot cards 2656 01:56:52,690 --> 01:56:49,100 have any relationship to traditional 2657 01:56:55,300 --> 01:56:52,700 playing cards yes they do and in fact 2658 01:57:02,800 --> 01:56:55,310 that's part of the history of the Tarot 2659 01:57:05,470 --> 01:57:02,810 is that come from well in nobody really 2660 01:57:08,020 --> 01:57:05,480 knows exactly how the Tarot got started 2661 01:57:12,130 --> 01:57:08,030 but the the earliest images which would 2662 01:57:15,190 --> 01:57:12,140 be from the Major Arcana as I mentioned 2663 01:57:18,040 --> 01:57:15,200 seem to be more oriented towards the 2664 01:57:22,390 --> 01:57:18,050 learned mnemonic learning tools okay we 2665 01:57:25,960 --> 01:57:22,400 have tarot cards playing cards nut poker 2666 01:57:27,970 --> 01:57:25,970 and Ouija boards lots more coming with 2667 01:57:30,700 --> 01:57:27,980 rosemary Reilly with Gene and Kris 2668 01:57:41,250 --> 01:57:38,000 [Music] 2669 01:57:44,520 --> 01:57:41,260 we also have swag you know we have all 2670 01:57:45,359 --> 01:57:44,530 these exclusive para cast things that 2671 01:57:47,310 --> 01:57:45,369 you can buy 2672 01:57:50,129 --> 01:57:47,320 we've got like I guess 60 or so 2673 01:57:53,699 --> 01:57:50,139 different items and entails t-shirts 2674 01:57:57,029 --> 01:57:53,709 sleeves for notebook computers iPad 2675 01:57:59,310 --> 01:57:57,039 cases mouse pads the para cast jumbo 2676 01:58:01,169 --> 01:57:59,320 tote bag all sorts of t-shirts and 2677 01:58:04,410 --> 01:58:01,179 jackets and stuff like that for men and 2678 01:58:06,689 --> 01:58:04,420 women we have a para cast aluminum water 2679 01:58:09,660 --> 01:58:06,699 bottle all the stuff you go to steward 2680 01:58:12,390 --> 01:58:09,670 on to the para cast comm store Doktor 2681 01:58:14,969 --> 01:58:12,400 power cast calm what makes special is 2682 01:58:17,910 --> 01:58:14,979 that the items are the best quality of 2683 01:58:19,620 --> 01:58:17,920 great t-shirts fabrics and they have our 2684 01:58:21,449 --> 01:58:19,630 official logo on them that's what makes 2685 01:58:22,080 --> 01:58:21,459 them special in multiple sizes and 2686 01:58:24,899 --> 01:58:22,090 colors 2687 01:58:27,239 --> 01:58:24,909 we even have stuff for children stuff 2688 01:58:29,969 --> 01:58:27,249 for women's stuff for men we have all 2689 01:58:32,129 --> 01:58:29,979 sorts of sizes like small up to X large 2690 01:58:34,620 --> 01:58:32,139 a lot good stuff that's 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02:00:55,649 --> 02:00:53,320 ticks with Lyme disease mosquitoes with 2748 02:00:57,779 --> 02:00:55,659 West Nile virus and cold and flu viruses 2749 02:00:59,729 --> 02:00:57,789 will be on the rise protect yourself 2750 02:01:03,149 --> 02:00:59,739 with nature's natural anti-parasitic 2751 02:01:05,040 --> 02:01:03,159 antiviral antifungal antibiotic Allison 2752 02:01:07,589 --> 02:01:05,050 the heart of garlic get concentrated 2753 02:01:09,839 --> 02:01:07,599 protection with a lessee and Ally ban 2754 02:01:12,179 --> 02:01:09,849 from affinity health products calm one 2755 02:01:14,669 --> 02:01:12,189 capsule of a lessee equals 40 cloves of 2756 02:01:16,799 --> 02:01:14,679 garlic or 100 garlic pills with no 2757 02:01:19,080 --> 02:01:16,809 garlic breath ally ban has Allison and 2758 02:01:21,000 --> 02:01:19,090 spray liquid and cream forms with three 2759 02:01:23,459 --> 02:01:21,010 times for strengthen leading brands and 2760 02:01:26,729 --> 02:01:23,469 cost less go to affinity health products 2761 02:01:29,129 --> 02:01:26,739 calm spelled AFF ini e why health 2762 02:01:30,870 --> 02:01:29,139 products calm or call each seven seven 2763 02:01:32,819 --> 02:01:30,880 eight eight eight seven one two six 2764 02:01:35,129 --> 02:01:32,829 that's eight seven seven eight eight 2765 02:01:37,500 --> 02:01:35,139 eight seventy one twenty six protect 2766 02:01:41,429 --> 02:01:37,510 yourself with a lessee or ally ban from 2767 02:01:43,500 --> 02:01:41,439 affinity health products calm we'd like 2768 02:01:46,109 --> 02:01:43,510 to hear from you if you have a comment 2769 02:01:47,730 --> 02:01:46,119 or question about the para cast sent it 2770 02:01:50,970 --> 02:01:47,740 to news 2771 02:01:53,550 --> 02:01:50,980 Ericka's cough that's news at the para 2772 02:01:56,310 --> 02:01:53,560 cast dot-com and don't forget to visit 2773 02:02:01,380 --> 02:01:56,320 our famous para cast community forums at 2774 02:02:02,610 --> 02:02:01,390 forum dr. Peric ask.com great visit with 2775 02:02:05,460 --> 02:02:02,620 rosemary ellen guiley 2776 02:02:07,710 --> 02:02:05,470 she's author of a brand new book which 2777 02:02:09,060 --> 02:02:07,720 is called we jig on Wilde and I have it 2778 02:02:11,040 --> 02:02:09,070 in front of me now we're gonna be asking 2779 02:02:12,480 --> 02:02:11,050 more things about the book and we were 2780 02:02:14,850 --> 02:02:12,490 going to the history of the tarot card 2781 02:02:16,560 --> 02:02:14,860 the playing card anymore to discuss 2782 02:02:17,010 --> 02:02:16,570 about that before we get on to another 2783 02:02:19,100 --> 02:02:17,020 question 2784 02:02:21,540 --> 02:02:19,110 well the tarot deck does incorporate 2785 02:02:23,580 --> 02:02:21,550 what we consider to be the playing cards 2786 02:02:27,150 --> 02:02:23,590 it has a Minor Arcana composed of four 2787 02:02:29,220 --> 02:02:27,160 suits and an extra court card than we 2788 02:02:32,250 --> 02:02:29,230 have in our playing cards but they are 2789 02:02:35,010 --> 02:02:32,260 now part of the Tarot it seems to me the 2790 02:02:36,500 --> 02:02:35,020 Tarot is a combination of I think cards 2791 02:02:38,880 --> 02:02:36,510 that were used for various purposes 2792 02:02:41,730 --> 02:02:38,890 let's move to another question here this 2793 02:02:43,260 --> 02:02:41,740 is one that's a segue Steve C who has 2794 02:02:45,510 --> 02:02:43,270 been a member of the parent cast 2795 02:02:48,300 --> 02:02:45,520 community forum since November 19th of 2796 02:02:51,360 --> 02:02:48,310 2011 can you have a brief discussion 2797 02:02:53,550 --> 02:02:51,370 with her about the paranormal activity 2798 02:02:56,370 --> 02:02:53,560 at the home you and her visited last 2799 02:02:58,020 --> 02:02:56,380 year that must be Chris for Chris you 2800 02:03:00,330 --> 02:02:58,030 mentioned it briefly a while back but I 2801 02:03:02,610 --> 02:03:00,340 want to hear more so let's segue what 2802 02:03:05,100 --> 02:03:02,620 about the home that you and rosemary 2803 02:03:08,220 --> 02:03:05,110 visited which one we visited two 2804 02:03:13,470 --> 02:03:08,230 actually but I think he may be referring 2805 02:03:15,210 --> 02:03:13,480 to the flower pot went on the floor well 2806 02:03:17,790 --> 02:03:15,220 that yeah that's what we were staying 2807 02:03:19,500 --> 02:03:17,800 but we actually visited the home or some 2808 02:03:21,750 --> 02:03:19,510 very interesting activity was occurring 2809 02:03:23,280 --> 02:03:21,760 and then him yes lien returning back to 2810 02:03:26,820 --> 02:03:23,290 the house where we were staying 2811 02:03:29,220 --> 02:03:26,830 I took rosemary to a location specific 2812 02:03:34,620 --> 02:03:29,230 spot it's actually quite small it's 2813 02:03:37,170 --> 02:03:34,630 about maybe 100 yards circle that seemed 2814 02:03:40,170 --> 02:03:37,180 to be the epicenter of several years 2815 02:03:43,650 --> 02:03:40,180 where it's a very very strange multi 2816 02:03:45,630 --> 02:03:43,660 various activity and and it was just it 2817 02:03:47,850 --> 02:03:45,640 was done on the spur of a moment at 2818 02:03:51,810 --> 02:03:47,860 about 11 o'clock at night normally when 2819 02:03:54,570 --> 02:03:51,820 I go into that area I kind of sit on 2820 02:03:57,360 --> 02:03:54,580 their periphery of it and kind of clear 2821 02:03:59,850 --> 02:03:57,370 my mind and just kind of slide or glide 2822 02:04:01,340 --> 02:03:59,860 into the the spot as opposed to just 2823 02:04:03,650 --> 02:04:01,350 burst it didn't slip 2824 02:04:05,660 --> 02:04:03,660 we did that night and I don't know 2825 02:04:08,960 --> 02:04:05,670 rosemary why don't you give your 2826 02:04:11,810 --> 02:04:08,970 particular kind of impressions of what 2827 02:04:14,270 --> 02:04:11,820 happened once we got to the to the area 2828 02:04:17,270 --> 02:04:14,280 and kind of give them your your 2829 02:04:18,830 --> 02:04:17,280 particular hit on one what happened and 2830 02:04:20,450 --> 02:04:18,840 we have described I think in the past 2831 02:04:21,980 --> 02:04:20,460 episode what happened once we returned 2832 02:04:24,230 --> 02:04:21,990 to the house where we were staying with 2833 02:04:27,140 --> 02:04:24,240 the potted plant jumping off the 2834 02:04:28,850 --> 02:04:27,150 windowsill but but what sort of feeling 2835 02:04:30,680 --> 02:04:28,860 did you get you're quite an experienced 2836 02:04:32,210 --> 02:04:30,690 one of the most experienced paranormal 2837 02:04:34,820 --> 02:04:32,220 investigators that I've ever worked with 2838 02:04:37,940 --> 02:04:34,830 if not the most experienced and I really 2839 02:04:39,890 --> 02:04:37,950 value your very grounded approach out in 2840 02:04:41,390 --> 02:04:39,900 the field what what did you pick up from 2841 02:04:41,900 --> 02:04:41,400 there what was your impression of that 2842 02:04:44,300 --> 02:04:41,910 SWAT 2843 02:04:46,790 --> 02:04:44,310 well that was so when we were in crest 2844 02:04:49,520 --> 02:04:46,800 stone and you know really Chris that was 2845 02:04:50,960 --> 02:04:49,530 one of the most amazing weeks we just 2846 02:04:53,690 --> 02:04:50,970 went to so many sites that were so 2847 02:04:56,360 --> 02:04:53,700 loaded with energy but I could 2848 02:04:58,280 --> 02:04:56,370 definitely feel the energy in that place 2849 02:05:00,440 --> 02:04:58,290 and this was like late at night it was 2850 02:05:03,640 --> 02:05:00,450 what around 11 or 12 o'clock by the time 2851 02:05:07,760 --> 02:05:03,650 we got there and the whole area was just 2852 02:05:09,320 --> 02:05:07,770 saturated with this this intense energy 2853 02:05:12,800 --> 02:05:09,330 and that was apparent to me as soon as 2854 02:05:15,440 --> 02:05:12,810 we started walking out into in into the 2855 02:05:16,850 --> 02:05:15,450 the ground so we stood there for a few 2856 02:05:20,300 --> 02:05:16,860 moments just sort of you know like 2857 02:05:22,040 --> 02:05:20,310 tuning our antennas or and and I think 2858 02:05:25,100 --> 02:05:22,050 we both started to experience things 2859 02:05:28,040 --> 02:05:25,110 simultaneously I started seeing moving 2860 02:05:30,680 --> 02:05:28,050 shapes coming at us and it seemed like 2861 02:05:32,330 --> 02:05:30,690 things like either came out of the night 2862 02:05:34,250 --> 02:05:32,340 or the ground I had another experience 2863 02:05:36,410 --> 02:05:34,260 in the area where I could see things 2864 02:05:40,130 --> 02:05:36,420 coming up out of the ground and these 2865 02:05:42,830 --> 02:05:40,140 shapes kind of misty shapes moving very 2866 02:05:45,680 --> 02:05:42,840 rapidly tortoise as though things were 2867 02:05:49,280 --> 02:05:45,690 coming to to either repel us or check us 2868 02:05:51,140 --> 02:05:49,290 out but we had a routing committee we 2869 02:06:00,650 --> 02:05:51,150 had a greeting committee and then I 2870 02:06:02,600 --> 02:06:00,660 could I think we better go it was and a 2871 02:06:04,430 --> 02:06:02,610 lot of intense energy coming our way and 2872 02:06:08,870 --> 02:06:04,440 then I could also see lots of small 2873 02:06:12,860 --> 02:06:08,880 lights to kind of ping-pong Inge around 2874 02:06:16,400 --> 02:06:12,870 the area moving very fast and 2875 02:06:17,750 --> 02:06:16,410 i we both felt it simultaneously you 2876 02:06:19,430 --> 02:06:17,760 know it's like well whatever's going on 2877 02:06:22,160 --> 02:06:19,440 here we shouldn't be here right now 2878 02:06:25,580 --> 02:06:22,170 maybe we should have you and Chris here 2879 02:06:28,880 --> 02:06:25,590 do a reality show I mean we had James 2880 02:06:31,100 --> 02:06:28,890 Fox of chasing UFOs and although James 2881 02:06:32,570 --> 02:06:31,110 is really a dedicated researcher just 2882 02:06:36,320 --> 02:06:32,580 about everybody says that show is very 2883 02:06:38,720 --> 02:06:36,330 bad that's miserable so Bank 2884 02:06:41,030 --> 02:06:38,730 oh he's getting spanked hard he's trying 2885 02:06:43,220 --> 02:06:41,040 he says he's trying but he's gotten 2886 02:06:45,560 --> 02:06:43,230 spanked hard over that show but what 2887 02:06:47,600 --> 02:06:45,570 about a show with you and rosemary going 2888 02:06:50,750 --> 02:06:47,610 ghost hunting or hunting any kind of 2889 02:06:52,580 --> 02:06:50,760 unusual events would anybody invests in 2890 02:06:54,950 --> 02:06:52,590 that a producer real producer who wants 2891 02:06:57,620 --> 02:06:54,960 to do quality television is there such a 2892 02:06:59,480 --> 02:06:57,630 thing unfortunately I don't think so 2893 02:07:01,580 --> 02:06:59,490 because if you look at a lot of these 2894 02:07:03,920 --> 02:07:01,590 shows they never really come up with 2895 02:07:06,080 --> 02:07:03,930 anything they either have to make it up 2896 02:07:07,670 --> 02:07:06,090 in order to have something dramatic for 2897 02:07:10,610 --> 02:07:07,680 TV or they don't come up with something 2898 02:07:12,410 --> 02:07:10,620 you have people like getting scared in 2899 02:07:14,090 --> 02:07:12,420 the dark Oh what was that and then it 2900 02:07:19,240 --> 02:07:14,100 turns out to be nothing but you know 2901 02:07:24,710 --> 02:07:22,940 Chris is definitely feeling the role his 2902 02:07:31,340 --> 02:07:24,720 decent rehearsing right now this is his 2903 02:07:33,740 --> 02:07:31,350 audition all right I'll tell you we 2904 02:07:36,560 --> 02:07:33,750 could pour it on you know we could pour 2905 02:07:38,300 --> 02:07:36,570 it on okay folks if you want if you're a 2906 02:07:41,150 --> 02:07:38,310 producer you know work for biography 2907 02:07:44,300 --> 02:07:41,160 channel a and II National Geographic 2908 02:07:47,540 --> 02:07:44,310 sci-fi channel we have rosemary ellen 2909 02:07:49,430 --> 02:07:47,550 guiley and Chris O'Brien they're 2910 02:07:53,290 --> 02:07:49,440 auditioning folks let's get to another 2911 02:07:56,540 --> 02:07:53,300 question okay here it is and this is 2912 02:07:59,720 --> 02:07:56,550 semi-related it comes from JT but a 2913 02:08:02,090 --> 02:07:59,730 member since 2009 he must be very tired 2914 02:08:04,370 --> 02:08:02,100 he says dowsing rarely gets mentioned 2915 02:08:07,280 --> 02:08:04,380 these days but I'm curious as to what 2916 02:08:09,620 --> 02:08:07,290 she thinks of it as an easy entry point 2917 02:08:11,720 --> 02:08:09,630 a tuning fork if you will to trying 2918 02:08:14,270 --> 02:08:11,730 things out for yourself is one of the 2919 02:08:16,040 --> 02:08:14,280 few instances were even professionals 2920 02:08:18,950 --> 02:08:16,050 like archaeologists and geologists are 2921 02:08:22,310 --> 02:08:18,960 inclined to accept its possible value 2922 02:08:25,430 --> 02:08:22,320 rosemary I love dowsing and I use both 2923 02:08:26,220 --> 02:08:25,440 the pendulum and the rods I've been 2924 02:08:28,620 --> 02:08:26,230 using rods and 2925 02:08:31,520 --> 02:08:28,630 increasingly in the last couple of years 2926 02:08:36,270 --> 02:08:31,530 when I've been working on long-term 2927 02:08:38,340 --> 02:08:36,280 negative cases these are areas where the 2928 02:08:41,940 --> 02:08:38,350 activity is very intense very chronic 2929 02:08:45,330 --> 02:08:41,950 and prolonged resistant to resolution 2930 02:08:46,979 --> 02:08:45,340 and I've been using them to to get an 2931 02:08:49,290 --> 02:08:46,989 energy picture of the land because I 2932 02:08:53,240 --> 02:08:49,300 believe that geophysical factors are an 2933 02:08:57,240 --> 02:08:53,250 important element in what makes an area 2934 02:08:59,880 --> 02:08:57,250 so intensely active we agree these 2935 02:09:03,720 --> 02:08:59,890 portal areas that never close but 2936 02:09:04,950 --> 02:09:03,730 dowsing is very easy to learn and you 2937 02:09:09,000 --> 02:09:04,960 know again the skeptics will say oh 2938 02:09:11,160 --> 02:09:09,010 you're moving these things yourself it's 2939 02:09:13,470 --> 02:09:11,170 about to every well drilling company in 2940 02:09:15,510 --> 02:09:13,480 the Rocky Mountains and in the southwest 2941 02:09:17,130 --> 02:09:15,520 exactly you can how do you think they 2942 02:09:20,220 --> 02:09:17,140 find well did they have professional 2943 02:09:22,500 --> 02:09:20,230 Bowser's come about my mother doubt my 2944 02:09:24,780 --> 02:09:22,510 brothers well three feet closer than the 2945 02:09:26,070 --> 02:09:24,790 professional Bowser did so I don't want 2946 02:09:28,229 --> 02:09:26,080 to hear about it from people saying that 2947 02:09:30,380 --> 02:09:28,239 it's all a bunch of hooey and they're 2948 02:09:32,880 --> 02:09:30,390 spending billions of dollars to do this 2949 02:09:36,240 --> 02:09:32,890 well why are you run with a willow 2950 02:09:38,190 --> 02:09:36,250 branch or a pair of copper rock oh and 2951 02:09:41,070 --> 02:09:38,200 there is such a thing as map dowsing as 2952 02:09:45,930 --> 02:09:41,080 well and now uri geller has been known 2953 02:09:48,990 --> 02:09:45,940 to map douse boil and natural gas for 2954 02:09:51,800 --> 02:09:49,000 for the major companies so I highly 2955 02:09:55,460 --> 02:09:51,810 recommend it it's very easy to learn 2956 02:09:58,950 --> 02:09:55,470 unlike a lot of electronic gear that 2957 02:10:01,620 --> 02:09:58,960 malfunctions during investigations or 2958 02:10:04,320 --> 02:10:01,630 the batteries run out those dowsing is 2959 02:10:06,479 --> 02:10:04,330 it's in that respect a primitive tool 2960 02:10:08,040 --> 02:10:06,489 because it's just you and the tool it's 2961 02:10:10,410 --> 02:10:08,050 never going to run out of batteries it's 2962 02:10:12,120 --> 02:10:10,420 always going to work you know Gauss to 2963 02:10:14,460 --> 02:10:12,130 get in touch with us just check us out 2964 02:10:16,440 --> 02:10:14,470 on Twitter the power cast at Twitter 2965 02:10:20,760 --> 02:10:16,450 this works we have rosemary ellen guiley 2966 02:10:28,669 --> 02:10:20,770 with gene and Chris you're in America 2967 02:10:33,359 --> 02:10:30,890 America's number one source for 2968 02:10:34,290 --> 02:10:33,369 independent talk retail for over a 2969 02:10:39,450 --> 02:10:34,300 decade 2970 02:10:41,879 --> 02:10:39,460 we are the gcn radio network graphic 2971 02:10:44,339 --> 02:10:41,889 converter is the image manipulation tool 2972 02:10:46,739 --> 02:10:44,349 for the rest of us it does not use any 2973 02:10:49,229 --> 02:10:46,749 database you get full control of all 2974 02:10:51,569 --> 02:10:49,239 your files want to view the images of a 2975 02:10:54,540 --> 02:10:51,579 folder drag it into graphic converter 2976 02:10:56,459 --> 02:10:54,550 and a powerful browser opens up to show 2977 02:10:58,919 --> 02:10:56,469 your image files you could use it for 2978 02:11:01,140 --> 02:10:58,929 slideshows you could use it to import 2979 02:11:03,540 --> 02:11:01,150 images from digital cameras or from 2980 02:11:05,520 --> 02:11:03,550 scanners need to do some 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comparative photos of 3050 02:13:58,530 --> 02:13:54,760 two cows please go to one world Wacom 3051 02:14:00,660 --> 02:13:58,540 that's one world WH ey comm and download 3052 02:14:03,360 --> 02:14:00,670 the free report on the miraculous health 3053 02:14:04,919 --> 02:14:03,370 benefits of unheated way in this report 3054 02:14:07,140 --> 02:14:04,929 is a website address that shows the 3055 02:14:09,120 --> 02:14:07,150 comparative photos of two cows the cows 3056 02:14:11,129 --> 02:14:09,130 ed cook milk looks sick compared to the 3057 02:14:12,990 --> 02:14:11,139 cow fed raw milk which looks healthy 3058 02:14:15,419 --> 02:14:13,000 after 21 years as a nutritional 3059 02:14:17,399 --> 02:14:15,429 consultant most protein powders do not 3060 02:14:19,919 --> 02:14:17,409 impress me as to either taste or health 3061 02:14:22,020 --> 02:14:19,929 benefits now I know that not all protein 3062 02:14:24,689 --> 02:14:22,030 powders are created equal and one world 3063 02:14:27,090 --> 02:14:24,699 way surpasses my fondest expectations in 3064 02:14:28,919 --> 02:14:27,100 both taste and health benefits call 3065 02:14:30,629 --> 02:14:28,929 eight eight eight nine eight eight three 3066 02:14:32,820 --> 02:14:30,639 three two five that's eight eight eight 3067 02:14:35,970 --> 02:14:32,830 nine eight eight three three two five or 3068 02:14:42,100 --> 02:14:35,980 visit one world wacom that's one world 3069 02:14:42,110 --> 02:14:46,900 [Music] 3070 02:14:55,880 --> 02:14:53,540 I'm just muted Pericles quickly about 3071 02:14:58,370 --> 02:14:55,890 dowsing rods rosemary ellen guiley on 3072 02:14:59,570 --> 02:14:58,380 the power cast with jean and chris what 3073 02:15:01,130 --> 02:14:59,580 kind of mechanism we're talking about 3074 02:15:04,000 --> 02:15:01,140 here so it's the individual in the 3075 02:15:06,500 --> 02:15:04,010 dowsing rod what is it they're sensing 3076 02:15:09,320 --> 02:15:06,510 electromagnetic radiation some condition 3077 02:15:11,720 --> 02:15:09,330 of the soil that sensed I think that 3078 02:15:14,050 --> 02:15:11,730 they they detect some sort of earth 3079 02:15:17,840 --> 02:15:14,060 energy and I think they are sensitive to 3080 02:15:20,690 --> 02:15:17,850 the configurations of the the soil the 3081 02:15:22,880 --> 02:15:20,700 magnetic content you are part of the 3082 02:15:24,980 --> 02:15:22,890 instrument as well and most dowsing rods 3083 02:15:26,690 --> 02:15:24,990 are copper rods in the old days they 3084 02:15:30,050 --> 02:15:26,700 just used twigs you know you see the 3085 02:15:32,180 --> 02:15:30,060 wood cuts of the the dowsers walking 3086 02:15:34,640 --> 02:15:32,190 around with the forked branches and the 3087 02:15:38,360 --> 02:15:34,650 things that were looking for water and 3088 02:15:40,880 --> 02:15:38,370 hazel was used as well and you know the 3089 02:15:43,520 --> 02:15:40,890 the pointer would dip down wherever the 3090 02:15:46,340 --> 02:15:43,530 water was supposed to be you are part 3091 02:15:48,530 --> 02:15:46,350 and here again mediumistic ability has a 3092 02:15:50,750 --> 02:15:48,540 lot to do with how active these these 3093 02:15:52,820 --> 02:15:50,760 tools are in your hands 3094 02:15:54,620 --> 02:15:52,830 and you tune yourself in to the 3095 02:15:57,380 --> 02:15:54,630 landscape to the spirit world to 3096 02:16:00,200 --> 02:15:57,390 whatever it is you're looking for now TC 3097 02:16:02,570 --> 02:16:00,210 Lethbridge who was an englishman who 3098 02:16:05,020 --> 02:16:02,580 wrote quite a bit about dowsing he said 3099 02:16:07,760 --> 02:16:05,030 everything has its own frequency and 3100 02:16:10,730 --> 02:16:07,770 when you really learn the art of dowsing 3101 02:16:12,800 --> 02:16:10,740 you tune yourself into the vibratory 3102 02:16:15,860 --> 02:16:12,810 frequency of whatever it is you're 3103 02:16:17,810 --> 02:16:15,870 looking for even if it's using a 3104 02:16:21,350 --> 02:16:17,820 pendulum to communicate with the dead 3105 02:16:24,380 --> 02:16:21,360 and that's where you find your success 3106 02:16:27,440 --> 02:16:24,390 in your results so you do set an 3107 02:16:30,050 --> 02:16:27,450 intention with dowsing in terms of what 3108 02:16:33,860 --> 02:16:30,060 you're what you are attempting to learn 3109 02:16:36,919 --> 02:16:33,870 through your tool and it is responsive 3110 02:16:38,959 --> 02:16:36,929 amazingly so now can anyone do this does 3111 02:16:41,060 --> 02:16:38,969 it require a lot of training is it 3112 02:16:44,300 --> 02:16:41,070 something you were born with the people 3113 02:16:46,760 --> 02:16:44,310 who have the most success and the 3114 02:16:50,030 --> 02:16:46,770 fastest results again have this kind of 3115 02:16:52,190 --> 02:16:50,040 natural mediumistic ability that is more 3116 02:16:54,390 --> 02:16:52,200 prominent for them than for other people 3117 02:16:55,860 --> 02:16:54,400 but any we all have it 3118 02:17:00,390 --> 02:16:55,870 degree and we can all train ourselves 3119 02:17:03,980 --> 02:17:00,400 and it is easy to use and learn you can 3120 02:17:08,210 --> 02:17:03,990 teach yourself the American Society of 3121 02:17:12,270 --> 02:17:08,220 dowsers has a lot of information and 3122 02:17:14,041 --> 02:17:12,280 training programs every year I spoke at 3123 02:17:16,500 --> 02:17:14,051 their conference this year and in 3124 02:17:18,690 --> 02:17:16,510 Vermont and they offer some wonderful 3125 02:17:20,850 --> 02:17:18,700 beginning intermediate and advanced 3126 02:17:23,850 --> 02:17:20,860 training to not only sense different 3127 02:17:27,240 --> 02:17:23,860 kinds of energy but also resolve energy 3128 02:17:29,520 --> 02:17:27,250 problems that you can you can come up 3129 02:17:31,910 --> 02:17:29,530 with solutions for people who are having 3130 02:17:35,990 --> 02:17:31,920 like water issues on their property or 3131 02:17:39,121 --> 02:17:36,000 certain kinds of spirit clearings I 3132 02:17:42,331 --> 02:17:39,131 think some of these the gin cases are 3133 02:17:44,070 --> 02:17:42,341 very resistant to just about any sort of 3134 02:17:45,930 --> 02:17:44,080 resolution but there are many things 3135 02:17:48,900 --> 02:17:45,940 that you can solve through dowsing 3136 02:17:50,970 --> 02:17:48,910 before you mention briefly portal areas 3137 02:17:52,890 --> 02:17:50,980 and we think of that in terms of places 3138 02:17:56,220 --> 02:17:52,900 where you have more paranormal events 3139 02:17:58,500 --> 02:17:56,230 more UFO sightings strange creatures etc 3140 02:18:02,160 --> 02:17:58,510 we're talking about the same thing yes 3141 02:18:03,960 --> 02:18:02,170 these are doorways window areas portal 3142 02:18:06,900 --> 02:18:03,970 areas that's the term I like to use 3143 02:18:08,970 --> 02:18:06,910 where they're the veils between the 3144 02:18:13,291 --> 02:18:08,980 dimensions are thinner and the 3145 02:18:14,760 --> 02:18:13,301 geophysical signatures of this side seem 3146 02:18:17,400 --> 02:18:14,770 to have a lot to do with it 3147 02:18:19,590 --> 02:18:17,410 that there are certain contents to the 3148 02:18:22,350 --> 02:18:19,600 soil the magnetic anomalies both 3149 02:18:25,770 --> 02:18:22,360 positive and negative that is where the 3150 02:18:31,320 --> 02:18:25,780 magnetic field is distorted either in 3151 02:18:33,090 --> 02:18:31,330 either direction in a market way that 3152 02:18:35,581 --> 02:18:33,100 this and I'm speaking here and not in 3153 02:18:37,680 --> 02:18:35,591 science terms but just from from my 3154 02:18:40,440 --> 02:18:37,690 observations and my own experience that 3155 02:18:44,010 --> 02:18:40,450 it seems to warp space somehow 3156 02:18:45,840 --> 02:18:44,020 interdimensional space to make make it 3157 02:18:49,230 --> 02:18:45,850 easier for things from other dimensions 3158 02:18:52,800 --> 02:18:49,240 to access our dimension these are areas 3159 02:18:55,831 --> 02:18:52,810 of ongoing activity where we find many 3160 02:18:58,700 --> 02:18:55,841 for example Bigfoot reports over years 3161 02:19:02,280 --> 02:18:58,710 and years mysterious lights in the sky 3162 02:19:04,410 --> 02:19:02,290 hauntings mysterious creatures intense 3163 02:19:06,871 --> 02:19:04,420 spirit activity that you can never get 3164 02:19:08,040 --> 02:19:06,881 rid of is resistant to exorcisms and 3165 02:19:09,959 --> 02:19:08,050 things like that 3166 02:19:11,580 --> 02:19:09,969 is this something we could measure or do 3167 02:19:13,410 --> 02:19:11,590 we measured by the nature of the 3168 02:19:15,570 --> 02:19:13,420 experiences that are happening I think 3169 02:19:17,639 --> 02:19:15,580 both there's I I think that there's a 3170 02:19:20,219 --> 02:19:17,649 way to document these things in hard 3171 02:19:22,320 --> 02:19:20,229 data as well as the anecdotal or soft 3172 02:19:24,809 --> 02:19:22,330 data there are certain patterns of 3173 02:19:26,820 --> 02:19:24,819 experiences and phenomena that happened 3174 02:19:28,860 --> 02:19:26,830 in these portal areas and that's that's 3175 02:19:32,250 --> 02:19:28,870 what I like to look at I like to look at 3176 02:19:34,349 --> 02:19:32,260 the soft data I think that there there 3177 02:19:37,049 --> 02:19:34,359 are ways that science can describe these 3178 02:19:40,200 --> 02:19:37,059 things and that's why I think examining 3179 02:19:43,530 --> 02:19:40,210 the the content of the soil the magnetic 3180 02:19:46,559 --> 02:19:43,540 fields and the contours of the land we 3181 02:19:48,900 --> 02:19:46,569 can get a hard data picture a better 3182 02:19:50,849 --> 02:19:48,910 picture of these these portal areas as 3183 02:19:52,590 --> 02:19:50,859 well I've been spending a lot of time in 3184 02:19:56,070 --> 02:19:52,600 southern Pennsylvania in the state of 3185 02:19:58,940 --> 02:19:56,080 West Virginia where in Pennsylvania the 3186 02:20:02,670 --> 02:19:58,950 southwestern corner that this would be 3187 02:20:07,800 --> 02:20:02,680 Green County Fayette County there have 3188 02:20:11,790 --> 02:20:07,810 been a lot of UFO reports for decades as 3189 02:20:13,770 --> 02:20:11,800 well and big Bigfoot boxes yeah that was 3190 02:20:16,770 --> 02:20:13,780 the corner that I'm concentrating on 3191 02:20:19,860 --> 02:20:16,780 would be green and Fayette and on down 3192 02:20:21,870 --> 02:20:19,870 into West Virginia and I've described 3193 02:20:23,790 --> 02:20:21,880 West Virginia the entire state as one 3194 02:20:26,429 --> 02:20:23,800 big portal it's got so much stuff going 3195 02:20:29,040 --> 02:20:26,439 on it now I lived for a number of years 3196 02:20:31,050 --> 02:20:29,050 in Southeast Pennsylvania about 40 miles 3197 02:20:33,360 --> 02:20:31,060 west of Philadelphia in the western 3198 02:20:35,130 --> 02:20:33,370 suburbs and we had some UFO cases there 3199 02:20:37,110 --> 02:20:35,140 I got one more question that came in at 3200 02:20:40,290 --> 02:20:37,120 the last minute from a very very long 3201 02:20:42,960 --> 02:20:40,300 time poster back from 2006 the first 3202 02:20:45,599 --> 02:20:42,970 year of the para cast and his name is 3203 02:20:48,330 --> 02:20:45,609 pixel Smith and he says I am quite good 3204 02:20:49,710 --> 02:20:48,340 at dowsing for electrical lines sewer 3205 02:20:52,889 --> 02:20:49,720 pipes water lines 3206 02:20:55,139 --> 02:20:52,899 septic tanks etc just by using two 3207 02:20:57,480 --> 02:20:55,149 pieces of wire I risked my life many 3208 02:20:59,520 --> 02:20:57,490 times by relying on my dowsing abilities 3209 02:21:02,550 --> 02:20:59,530 before digging around power lines 3210 02:21:05,730 --> 02:21:02,560 high-pressure gas mains etc I wonder too 3211 02:21:07,530 --> 02:21:05,740 of dowsing can be utilized in paranormal 3212 02:21:10,260 --> 02:21:07,540 research effectively I have been 3213 02:21:12,510 --> 02:21:10,270 advocating that paranormal investigators 3214 02:21:15,660 --> 02:21:12,520 learn how to dowse I think it is an 3215 02:21:17,670 --> 02:21:15,670 important tool that gets way overlooked 3216 02:21:21,630 --> 02:21:17,680 with all of this over emphasis on 3217 02:21:23,729 --> 02:21:21,640 high-tech gadgetry which has its place 3218 02:21:26,070 --> 02:21:23,739 but it's not the whole picture it has 3219 02:21:28,200 --> 02:21:26,080 its place but there are other tools that 3220 02:21:30,479 --> 02:21:28,210 yield different kinds of information and 3221 02:21:33,059 --> 02:21:30,489 yes you know he's right you can take a 3222 02:21:35,910 --> 02:21:33,069 coat hanger and do all kinds of 3223 02:21:39,660 --> 02:21:35,920 incredible dousing it's not so much the 3224 02:21:42,300 --> 02:21:39,670 tool itself it's the tool becomes part 3225 02:21:44,160 --> 02:21:42,310 of a process that you are you the human 3226 02:21:47,820 --> 02:21:44,170 being is involved in as well that's a 3227 02:21:50,490 --> 02:21:47,830 tuning to these things that are extra 3228 02:21:52,920 --> 02:21:50,500 dimensional you can make a pendulum out 3229 02:21:54,899 --> 02:21:52,930 of you know plumbing materials and a 3230 02:21:57,389 --> 02:21:54,909 piece of string and have it work it 3231 02:22:01,410 --> 02:21:57,399 doesn't have to be a on a silver chain 3232 02:22:04,710 --> 02:22:01,420 and you know fancy fancy Bob it's my 3233 02:22:07,050 --> 02:22:04,720 process yeah a silver chain with a small 3234 02:22:09,330 --> 02:22:07,060 round slightly larger than you know like 3235 02:22:11,910 --> 02:22:09,340 the size of a large marble there was an 3236 02:22:13,979 --> 02:22:11,920 old watch and that looked like an 3237 02:22:15,870 --> 02:22:13,989 eyeball and she would wear it around her 3238 02:22:17,429 --> 02:22:15,880 neck that was a watch and she'd whipped 3239 02:22:20,010 --> 02:22:17,439 that thing off and she'd Dow to hit the 3240 02:22:22,439 --> 02:22:20,020 drop of a hat if he wanted to to get an 3241 02:22:24,360 --> 02:22:22,449 answer to a question she didn't do this 3242 02:22:27,360 --> 02:22:24,370 in public and she didn't do it very 3243 02:22:29,880 --> 02:22:27,370 often but as a kid I remember being 3244 02:22:31,830 --> 02:22:29,890 fascinated by that and asking her you 3245 02:22:34,229 --> 02:22:31,840 know what are you doing how does it work 3246 02:22:35,729 --> 02:22:34,239 do you think it's it's it's real I mean 3247 02:22:38,820 --> 02:22:35,739 I asked I think pretty intelligent 3248 02:22:42,330 --> 02:22:38,830 questions and she told me yeah your 3249 02:22:43,800 --> 02:22:42,340 grandfather has been dowsing for years 3250 02:22:45,179 --> 02:22:43,810 taught me how to do it when I was little 3251 02:22:46,800 --> 02:22:45,189 and here let me show you how to do it 3252 02:22:49,019 --> 02:22:46,810 and I've owned eight nine years old how 3253 02:22:52,380 --> 02:22:49,029 do how do you spend alone for doubting 3254 02:22:55,439 --> 02:22:52,390 and then and as I mentioned couple times 3255 02:22:58,530 --> 02:22:55,449 on the para cast uh she was the one that 3256 02:23:00,450 --> 02:22:58,540 doubt my brothers well and as I said she 3257 02:23:02,280 --> 02:23:00,460 came three I think the four feet closer 3258 02:23:04,260 --> 02:23:02,290 than the professional douser came out 3259 02:23:07,229 --> 02:23:04,270 with the well-drilling company so she 3260 02:23:08,820 --> 02:23:07,239 would very have some real talent and and 3261 02:23:11,820 --> 02:23:08,830 I agree rosemary I think it is an 3262 02:23:14,040 --> 02:23:11,830 overlooked tool I think someone with a 3263 02:23:16,170 --> 02:23:14,050 little bit of training and obviously 3264 02:23:17,849 --> 02:23:16,180 some natural abilities and mediumistic 3265 02:23:20,630 --> 02:23:17,859 abilities so it's going to be helpful 3266 02:23:23,280 --> 02:23:20,640 but anybody can doubt it's a matter of 3267 02:23:26,099 --> 02:23:23,290 putting the time and getting a little 3268 02:23:28,769 --> 02:23:26,109 bit of education and and working with it 3269 02:23:31,170 --> 02:23:28,779 and experiment you have somebody bury 3270 02:23:34,200 --> 02:23:31,180 something in a yard without you knowing 3271 02:23:35,131 --> 02:23:34,210 where it is and then work on identifying 3272 02:23:38,671 --> 02:23:35,141 the look 3273 02:23:41,011 --> 02:23:38,681 and it's uncanny how accurate it can be 3274 02:23:44,251 --> 02:23:41,021 and it's one of the areas I think 3275 02:23:46,591 --> 02:23:44,261 skeptics tend to kind of just gloss over 3276 02:23:49,140 --> 02:23:46,601 and they say oh I can't be real and they 3277 02:23:51,270 --> 02:23:49,150 don't really look at the fact that Davin 3278 02:23:53,970 --> 02:23:51,280 has been shown to be an effective tool 3279 02:23:57,171 --> 02:23:53,980 for hundreds and hundreds of years and 3280 02:24:02,371 --> 02:23:57,181 there's no getting around that fact so I 3281 02:24:04,531 --> 02:24:02,381 look people who who use dowsing will use 3282 02:24:08,871 --> 02:24:04,541 it in almost everything in life they 3283 02:24:11,520 --> 02:24:08,881 will douse books they will douse food 3284 02:24:13,470 --> 02:24:11,530 objects you know should should they have 3285 02:24:14,611 --> 02:24:13,480 something you know maybe we can get the 3286 02:24:16,201 --> 02:24:14,621 Dow's for money 3287 02:24:18,571 --> 02:24:16,211 I've talked to you about that we have 3288 02:24:21,180 --> 02:24:18,581 rosemary ellen guiley we have to make 3289 02:24:30,690 --> 02:24:21,190 some money now for our benefactors Dana 3290 02:24:33,751 --> 02:24:30,700 and Chris are you tired of searching for 3291 02:24:35,041 --> 02:24:33,761 a great talk radio more important search 3292 02:24:39,541 --> 02:24:35,051 from over 3293 02:24:41,970 --> 02:24:39,551 we are the GCM radio network if you want 3294 02:24:44,940 --> 02:24:41,980 to get your website online and you need 3295 02:24:46,831 --> 02:24:44,950 reliable service first-class service at 3296 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3351 02:27:09,030 --> 02:27:06,939 designed for your business or Church 3352 02:27:11,730 --> 02:27:09,040 what does it mean how about a 50 by 100 3353 02:27:13,050 --> 02:27:11,740 foot building for under $30,000 don't 3354 02:27:15,620 --> 02:27:13,060 pay thousands more than you should 3355 02:27:18,960 --> 02:27:15,630 without calling general steel first call 3356 02:27:20,790 --> 02:27:18,970 898 steel today and save as much as half 3357 02:27:23,160 --> 02:27:20,800 the cost and time of conventional 3358 02:27:25,230 --> 02:27:23,170 construction don't let rising steel 3359 02:27:27,510 --> 02:27:25,240 prices put your project in jeopardy 3360 02:27:29,670 --> 02:27:27,520 call now to lock in your price for 3 3361 02:27:31,710 --> 02:27:29,680 months call eight six six ninety nine 3362 02:27:34,860 --> 02:27:31,720 steel that's eight six six nine nine 3363 02:27:36,690 --> 02:27:34,870 seven 8335 don't spend thousands of 3364 02:27:40,200 --> 02:27:36,700 dollars more than you 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witnesses to the 3393 02:28:50,980 --> 02:28:46,140 Rendlesham UFO incident you're listening 3394 02:28:50,990 --> 02:28:55,001 [Music] 3395 02:29:03,680 --> 02:28:58,131 this has been so much fun rosemary ellen 3396 02:29:05,060 --> 02:29:03,690 guiley the always fun this is something 3397 02:29:06,201 --> 02:29:05,070 where I'm just having a great time 3398 02:29:07,940 --> 02:29:06,211 because I'm not an expert of weed 3399 02:29:09,921 --> 02:29:07,950 reports all I know is what I read in the 3400 02:29:12,921 --> 02:29:09,931 papers or this book weed you gone wild 3401 02:29:14,361 --> 02:29:12,931 shocking true stories and we'd only have 3402 02:29:16,871 --> 02:29:14,371 one segment left I want to ask a couple 3403 02:29:19,281 --> 02:29:16,881 of quick questions here obviously 3404 02:29:21,291 --> 02:29:19,291 everybody talks about vampires now again 3405 02:29:23,871 --> 02:29:21,301 now and again of course we have the TV 3406 02:29:27,560 --> 02:29:23,881 series True Blood which is just wild and 3407 02:29:30,111 --> 02:29:27,570 wacky and pushes envelopes in different 3408 02:29:34,640 --> 02:29:30,121 ways I noticed that you have a chapter 3409 02:29:37,581 --> 02:29:34,650 called a choir of vampires pray tell 3410 02:29:40,751 --> 02:29:37,591 what's that one of the weirdest Ouija 3411 02:29:45,440 --> 02:29:40,761 board cases I've ever come across and 3412 02:29:48,470 --> 02:29:45,450 this was it was told to me by she was in 3413 02:29:50,480 --> 02:29:48,480 her 30s at that point about some high 3414 02:29:54,951 --> 02:29:50,490 school experiences that took place in 3415 02:29:57,140 --> 02:29:54,961 the early 70s with her and started out 3416 02:30:01,041 --> 02:29:57,150 with two other girls one of whom again 3417 02:30:02,480 --> 02:30:01,051 this validates the mediumistic thing she 3418 02:30:04,251 --> 02:30:02,490 was the trigger she was a psychic 3419 02:30:07,461 --> 02:30:04,261 trigger because she had the natural 3420 02:30:08,930 --> 02:30:07,471 ability and these two girls got involved 3421 02:30:12,680 --> 02:30:08,940 with a Ouija board 3422 02:30:14,841 --> 02:30:12,690 they were both dark shadows fans and I 3423 02:30:18,051 --> 02:30:14,851 think that there was that there was a 3424 02:30:21,230 --> 02:30:18,061 genuine entity contact it used dark 3425 02:30:23,480 --> 02:30:21,240 shadows a TV serial the TV serial we're 3426 02:30:25,640 --> 02:30:23,490 not talking about that movie that failed 3427 02:30:28,100 --> 02:30:25,650 with Johnny Depp we're talking about the 3428 02:30:31,131 --> 02:30:28,110 original one from the original TV series 3429 02:30:34,220 --> 02:30:31,141 with Barnabas Collins played by Jonathan 3430 02:30:37,251 --> 02:30:34,230 Fred it was the the Gothic soap opera 3431 02:30:39,621 --> 02:30:37,261 that you know school school kids ran 3432 02:30:42,440 --> 02:30:39,631 home every day you know just to catch it 3433 02:30:46,671 --> 02:30:42,450 on school and it started in the 60s and 3434 02:30:48,261 --> 02:30:46,681 I it ended in I believe 1972 it had a 3435 02:30:51,980 --> 02:30:48,271 very long run and was hugely popular 3436 02:30:54,861 --> 02:30:51,990 well these girls were fans and so the 3437 02:30:56,871 --> 02:30:54,871 entities who responded on the Ouija 3438 02:30:58,341 --> 02:30:56,881 board the first one who's me he said his 3439 02:31:01,730 --> 02:30:58,351 name was Devon and he said he was a 3440 02:31:04,911 --> 02:31:01,740 vampire and his story sounded very much 3441 02:31:06,951 --> 02:31:04,921 like Barnabas Collins and that you know 3442 02:31:08,631 --> 02:31:06,961 he was separated from his long-lost love 3443 02:31:11,091 --> 02:31:08,641 and it just happened to be 3444 02:31:13,041 --> 02:31:11,101 this one girl who was mediumistic so I 3445 02:31:16,581 --> 02:31:13,051 think there was some subconscious stuff 3446 02:31:21,291 --> 02:31:16,591 going on there but also I do think there 3447 02:31:23,150 --> 02:31:21,301 was a real nasty entity who played out 3448 02:31:25,611 --> 02:31:23,160 the story that they wanted to hear so 3449 02:31:30,890 --> 02:31:25,621 they were all excited about it they get 3450 02:31:33,261 --> 02:31:30,900 the third girl involved and this entity 3451 02:31:35,541 --> 02:31:33,271 then introduces other entities who 3452 02:31:38,301 --> 02:31:35,551 communicate on the Ouija board and they 3453 02:31:40,161 --> 02:31:38,311 call themselves the vampire choir so 3454 02:31:42,461 --> 02:31:40,171 it's Devon and the vampire choir and 3455 02:31:47,480 --> 02:31:42,471 they spin these stories about being 3456 02:31:49,161 --> 02:31:47,490 vampires in the 1700s and and then the 3457 02:31:52,551 --> 02:31:49,171 messages start to get progressively 3458 02:31:55,520 --> 02:31:52,561 nastier where they're delivering bad 3459 02:31:57,140 --> 02:31:55,530 news and the girls are going to die and 3460 02:31:59,390 --> 02:31:57,150 they're spying on them all the time they 3461 02:32:02,440 --> 02:31:59,400 even follow them into dressing rooms to 3462 02:32:05,001 --> 02:32:02,450 watch them undress in department stores 3463 02:32:08,301 --> 02:32:05,011 poltergeist effect started happening in 3464 02:32:10,341 --> 02:32:08,311 the homes of these girls the one girl 3465 02:32:12,560 --> 02:32:10,351 the mediumistic girl says that Devon 3466 02:32:16,251 --> 02:32:12,570 she's letting Devon drink her blood and 3467 02:32:20,321 --> 02:32:16,261 and she's got these marks on her neck it 3468 02:32:25,220 --> 02:32:20,331 just went from fun a game really weird 3469 02:32:28,011 --> 02:32:25,230 into this nightmare where and they bring 3470 02:32:30,470 --> 02:32:28,021 in other kids they try magic spells to 3471 02:32:32,390 --> 02:32:30,480 try and get the vampires to go away they 3472 02:32:35,571 --> 02:32:32,400 stop using the board the vampires are 3473 02:32:39,680 --> 02:32:35,581 still plaguing their nightmares and 3474 02:32:41,841 --> 02:32:39,690 poltergeist stuff at home and the only 3475 02:32:45,621 --> 02:32:41,851 way that this one girl managed to 3476 02:32:49,461 --> 02:32:45,631 extricate herself was to leave the group 3477 02:32:52,730 --> 02:32:49,471 and the group split up and she for years 3478 02:32:56,381 --> 02:32:52,740 she was traumatized by this and felt she 3479 02:32:59,390 --> 02:32:56,391 had a spirit attachment she then got to 3480 02:33:01,310 --> 02:32:59,400 deliverances to Pentecostal style 3481 02:33:04,251 --> 02:33:01,320 deliverances which she said were more 3482 02:33:11,501 --> 02:33:04,261 harrowing experiences that she had with 3483 02:33:17,261 --> 02:33:14,631 and she was having visits shadow people 3484 02:33:20,480 --> 02:33:17,271 visits you know which were coming into 3485 02:33:22,550 --> 02:33:20,490 to her room she said it was year she had 3486 02:33:25,760 --> 02:33:22,560 to come make a complete break 3487 02:33:28,820 --> 02:33:25,770 with anything occult or paranormal and 3488 02:33:30,950 --> 02:33:28,830 it was slept with the lights on and at 3489 02:33:32,780 --> 02:33:30,960 the time she gave me the interviews she 3490 02:33:35,090 --> 02:33:32,790 said you know she still was sleeping 3491 02:33:37,100 --> 02:33:35,100 with the lights on she had five dogs you 3492 02:33:38,570 --> 02:33:37,110 know she was trying to you know protect 3493 02:33:42,020 --> 02:33:38,580 herself against something that she 3494 02:33:44,810 --> 02:33:42,030 couldn't see but the freakiest thing was 3495 02:33:47,390 --> 02:33:44,820 the girl who had the mediumistic ability 3496 02:33:50,900 --> 02:33:47,400 who was supposedly being vamper eyes she 3497 02:33:53,420 --> 02:33:50,910 goes on and gets married and one day she 3498 02:33:54,830 --> 02:33:53,430 and the husband come to visit this the 3499 02:33:59,230 --> 02:33:54,840 girl who went through the the 3500 02:34:02,660 --> 02:33:59,240 deliverances and so the husband takes 3501 02:34:06,230 --> 02:34:02,670 the the friend of science says how well 3502 02:34:08,060 --> 02:34:06,240 did you know Devon and apparently this 3503 02:34:13,280 --> 02:34:08,070 girl had told her that Devon was an old 3504 02:34:18,350 --> 02:34:13,290 boyfriend and the friend looked at him 3505 02:34:21,200 --> 02:34:18,360 said Devon's not human and the guy just 3506 02:34:24,250 --> 02:34:21,210 kind of freaked out because he had been 3507 02:34:27,530 --> 02:34:24,260 told that Devon had been a real person 3508 02:34:29,960 --> 02:34:27,540 but there it was a very complicated 3509 02:34:32,540 --> 02:34:29,970 picture because clearly this this other 3510 02:34:35,660 --> 02:34:32,550 person who had the mediumistic ability 3511 02:34:40,490 --> 02:34:35,670 was very much wrapped up in a fantasy as 3512 02:34:42,980 --> 02:34:40,500 well and my feeling was that an entity 3513 02:34:45,770 --> 02:34:42,990 had taken advantage of that and just 3514 02:34:49,940 --> 02:34:45,780 played it for what it could get out of 3515 02:34:51,170 --> 02:34:49,950 it what can I say for the amazing stuff 3516 02:34:53,690 --> 02:34:51,180 I mean when you look at some of these 3517 02:34:57,260 --> 02:34:53,700 case histories it's you know it's hard 3518 02:35:01,090 --> 02:34:57,270 to separate out where a person's 3519 02:35:03,440 --> 02:35:01,100 preconceptions and belief and 3520 02:35:06,320 --> 02:35:03,450 expectation leaves off and where 3521 02:35:09,890 --> 02:35:06,330 something truly other is introduced into 3522 02:35:12,290 --> 02:35:09,900 it and it's even harder to differentiate 3523 02:35:14,000 --> 02:35:12,300 between the two once you start the chain 3524 02:35:16,820 --> 02:35:14,010 of events like you've just described 3525 02:35:19,970 --> 02:35:16,830 it's very difficult to separate out what 3526 02:35:23,690 --> 02:35:19,980 is truly other if if if you can even do 3527 02:35:26,360 --> 02:35:23,700 that and what is all projection by by 3528 02:35:29,030 --> 02:35:26,370 the experiencer and then keep out of 3529 02:35:31,400 --> 02:35:29,040 anybody I've ever worked with or have 3530 02:35:32,900 --> 02:35:31,410 been aware of in the field you're one of 3531 02:35:35,341 --> 02:35:32,910 the few people I would trust in that 3532 02:35:38,761 --> 02:35:35,351 process to try to 3533 02:35:41,190 --> 02:35:38,771 separate out what's you know maybe some 3534 02:35:43,890 --> 02:35:41,200 sort of psychological element versus 3535 02:35:45,451 --> 02:35:43,900 something truly in need of being 3536 02:35:48,810 --> 02:35:45,461 addressed in terms of something that is 3537 02:35:51,631 --> 02:35:48,820 separate from the experiencer and I must 3538 02:35:52,770 --> 02:35:51,641 say I'm it wasn't as you know I am one 3539 02:35:57,331 --> 02:35:52,780 of your biggest fans 3540 02:35:59,701 --> 02:35:57,341 I urge everybody to read your 56 is this 3541 02:36:02,671 --> 02:35:59,711 your 57th book how many books have you 3542 02:36:04,921 --> 02:36:02,681 in something like that it's somewhere in 3543 02:36:09,451 --> 02:36:04,931 the mid depth or 50s I've kind of lost 3544 02:36:12,060 --> 02:36:09,461 track nine encyclopedias I think I do 3545 02:36:15,091 --> 02:36:12,070 recommend to work highly you are one of 3546 02:36:18,631 --> 02:36:15,101 the most important figures in the field 3547 02:36:20,821 --> 02:36:18,641 and it is a pleasure to have worked with 3548 02:36:22,440 --> 02:36:20,831 you and hopefully continue working with 3549 02:36:24,091 --> 02:36:22,450 you and of course having on the pair of 3550 02:36:28,051 --> 02:36:24,101 cast you're one of my favorite guests 3551 02:36:29,821 --> 02:36:28,061 and I think everybody is is really well 3552 02:36:31,621 --> 02:36:29,831 served by bringing themselves up to 3553 02:36:34,230 --> 02:36:31,631 speed with your very good writing and 3554 02:36:36,241 --> 02:36:34,240 you have a very accessible style and boy 3555 02:36:38,940 --> 02:36:36,251 I'll tell you you can research your your 3556 02:36:40,621 --> 02:36:38,950 tail off you are really amazing Chris 3557 02:36:42,871 --> 02:36:40,631 and I we've got to do some more in the 3558 02:36:45,571 --> 02:36:42,881 valley there there's a lot of ground to 3559 02:36:48,031 --> 02:36:45,581 be covered yep yep we just lickin the 3560 02:36:49,591 --> 02:36:48,041 tip of the proverbial iceberg and thing 3561 02:36:52,020 --> 02:36:49,601 to say about this book this book is not 3562 02:36:54,961 --> 02:36:52,030 you know a 2,000 page book it's like 220 3563 02:36:57,031 --> 02:36:54,971 pages it's a fairly short book you get 3564 02:36:58,831 --> 02:36:57,041 through it in a few hours has a lot of 3565 02:37:01,531 --> 02:36:58,841 interesting information and there's also 3566 02:37:04,831 --> 02:37:01,541 a second or 10 books about 3567 02:37:07,850 --> 02:37:04,841 Ouija boards in the movies where it's 3568 02:37:12,390 --> 02:37:07,860 been featured as a character and 3569 02:37:14,161 --> 02:37:12,400 appliance whatever okay and the Ouija 3570 02:37:18,751 --> 02:37:14,171 board is it's it's always been portrayed 3571 02:37:21,991 --> 02:37:18,761 as a device for accessing the spooky and 3572 02:37:24,001 --> 02:37:22,001 over the course of time and primarily 3573 02:37:28,051 --> 02:37:24,011 from The Exorcist on it's been 3574 02:37:29,850 --> 02:37:28,061 associated with demonic things and you 3575 02:37:33,421 --> 02:37:29,860 know Bob Murch pointed out to me he said 3576 02:37:36,480 --> 02:37:33,431 which board which came out in 1986 took 3577 02:37:38,400 --> 02:37:36,490 every Ouija superstition and and then 3578 02:37:41,400 --> 02:37:38,410 some and made up some of its own and 3579 02:37:45,451 --> 02:37:41,410 mash them all together and they created 3580 02:37:48,390 --> 02:37:45,461 this kind of negative demonic persona 3581 02:37:49,170 --> 02:37:48,400 for the board that you know if you if 3582 02:37:51,030 --> 02:37:49,180 you go out and 3583 02:37:52,740 --> 02:37:51,040 ask a lot of people today about the 3584 02:37:54,510 --> 02:37:52,750 Ouija board a fair number of them will 3585 02:37:56,460 --> 02:37:54,520 say oh no wouldn't touch it it's evil 3586 02:37:58,260 --> 02:37:56,470 but if you ask them how they know what's 3587 02:38:00,179 --> 02:37:58,270 evil or why it's evil they they're 3588 02:38:02,280 --> 02:38:00,189 usually not even able to tell you they 3589 02:38:03,840 --> 02:38:02,290 just know it is because they've heard it 3590 02:38:06,420 --> 02:38:03,850 from so and so we heard from so-and-so 3591 02:38:09,059 --> 02:38:06,430 sort of things like seeing a hammer or a 3592 02:38:10,320 --> 02:38:09,069 saw is just not the case the book is 3593 02:38:12,300 --> 02:38:10,330 called Ouija gone wild 3594 02:38:14,580 --> 02:38:12,310 shocking true stories from rosemary 3595 02:38:16,080 --> 02:38:14,590 ellen guiley and rick fisher I assume 3596 02:38:17,639 --> 02:38:16,090 available everywhere soon to be 3597 02:38:19,320 --> 02:38:17,649 available everywhere it's currently 3598 02:38:22,290 --> 02:38:19,330 available my website visionary 3599 02:38:24,719 --> 02:38:22,300 living.com and will be up on Amazon and 3600 02:38:26,820 --> 02:38:24,729 on Kindle very soon Chris O'Brien of 3601 02:38:29,490 --> 02:38:26,830 course has our strange planet calm he 3602 02:38:32,010 --> 02:38:29,500 started updating again with a brand new 3603 02:38:34,439 --> 02:38:32,020 design he's going to integrate the 3604 02:38:37,830 --> 02:38:34,449 webcam coming soon and lots of other 3605 02:38:39,900 --> 02:38:37,840 stuff you could reach us on Twitter the 3606 02:38:41,880 --> 02:38:39,910 power cast we are the power cast on 3607 02:38:44,160 --> 02:38:41,890 Twitter we have a fan club on Facebook 3608 02:38:45,809 --> 02:38:44,170 and that's how it goes rosemary ellen 3609 02:38:47,939 --> 02:38:45,819 guiley thanks for joining us this week 3610 02:38:56,690 --> 02:38:47,949 on the power cast thank you Jane and 3611 02:39:03,240 --> 02:39:00,210 the para cast featuring Jean Steinberg 3612 02:39:06,110 --> 02:39:03,250 and Christopher O'Brien is a copyrighted 3613 02:39:09,840 --> 02:39:06,120 presentation of making the impossible